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02-26-2011, 07:51 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Gloversville, NY
Posts: 1,587
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Vern,
Just watched the video at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GvaFtmAzxNk That's amazing! Never knew such tools existed. I can just image how easy that would make the longeron bending. No wonder you can do them in an hour! Problem is, most of us novice builders have no clue about advanced techniques and tools like this.
Others with "Longeron Frustration",
Strongly suggest you find someone in your area with building experience, or better yet, someone with these kind of tools.
John
__________________
John Peck, CFII, A&P, EAA Tech Counselor, Flight Advisor.
?Master Pilot? Award, UFO Member.
RV-12 N37JP 120176 Flying since 2012.
One Week Wonder Build Team, OSH 2018.
VAF paid through 10/2019.
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02-26-2011, 09:16 AM
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 845
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJohn
Vern,
Just watched the video at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GvaFtmAzxNk That's amazing! Never knew such tools existed. I can just image how easy that would make the longeron bending. No wonder you can do them in an hour! Problem is, most of us novice builders...
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... don't have access to, or the dollars required to buy, tools like that for a one-time job.
I got through my longerons at the cost of a few hours of frustration and a broken vise (I found opening the angle to be more difficult than the bending), and I have no problem with having had to do so, but I do marvel at some of the inconsistencies in Van's decisions as to what we should do for ourselves versus what they will do for us with their high-end production machine tools.
I somewhat tongue-in-cheek refer to their part-time hole dimpler, who only shows up to dimple holes that 1) I could have done myself, and/or 2) I wish they hadn't dimpled for me because I would like to have been able to break that edge. In comparison, I would have traded those dimples for a formed pair of longerons in a heartbeat. With a production set-up in place, they could form those longerons in seconds. Considering the importance of those two parts in strength and alignment of other parts of the airframe, it would seem to benefit all involved if they did.
__________________
Dave Gamble
Grove City, OH
RV-6 N466PG Purchased already flying - SOLD!
The Book: The PapaGolf Chronicles
Built RV-12
http://www.schmetterlingaviation.com
The Book: Being written.
The above web blogs and any links provided thereto are not instructional or advisory in nature. They merely seek to share my experiences in building and flying Van's RV airplanes.
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02-26-2011, 11:40 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Vul, VA
Posts: 316
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JEG
Sometime back I remember reading a post from a person who had built some dies to assist in bending the longerons.
Wasn't interested at the time but now my fuselage is on order. Does anyone out there know who it was that had these for sale? Thanks, John
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That's sad when a longeron dies- there aren't many left in this world.
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02-26-2011, 04:03 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: San Pedro
Posts: 1,013
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Business Opportunity
There are a lot or RV builders out there who would like to have his/her longerons bent for them. Someone who already has an RV assist business already set up seem ideal. Bending them might be easy and inexpensive to do but the shipping might be the expensive part of that business. Wonder why Van's doesn't offer this 'option'. like the fuel tank?
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02-26-2011, 04:24 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 863
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prporter
That's sad when a longeron dies- there aren't many left in this world.
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I had the opportunity to meet with Jean-Marie Longeron who was from an old French aristocratic lineage. They dropped their noble patronym after the French revolution, before that they were known as the Counts "Longeron de Fuselage".
I just learned that Jean-Marie died after a life full of twists and blows, it is a sad story but it is good that he is memorialized in the VAF forum, he would like it because we have lots of respect here for the Longerons, particularly if they are Longerons de Fuselage.
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02-26-2011, 06:48 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Ridgecrest, CA
Posts: 126
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WingedFrog
I had the opportunity to meet with Jean-Marie Longeron who was from an old French aristocratic lineage. They dropped their noble patronym after the French revolution, before that they were known as the Counts "Longeron de Fuselage".
I just learned that Jean-Marie died after a life full of twists and blows, it is a sad story but it is good that he is memorialized in the VAF forum, he would like it because we have lots of respect here for the Longerons, particularly if they are Longerons de Fuselage.
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I am of Fuselage lineage, my mother's family coming to this country from said village not far from Versailles.
__________________
Dan Wright
Building RV-12 #511 in the Mojave desert (1976W reserved)
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02-27-2011, 08:13 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Vul, VA
Posts: 316
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanWright
I am of Fuselage lineage, my mother's family coming to this country from said village not far from Versailles.
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I was on a tour bus in Versailles, and had the opportunity to meet The Baron du Fuselage Longeron- he is from the lesser known side of the lineage, and informed me that he still is not on speaking terms with the rest of the family. He then bought me a croissant.
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02-27-2011, 10:56 AM
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 845
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prporter
I was on a tour bus in Versailles, and had the opportunity to meet The Baron du Fuselage Longeron- he is from the lesser known side of the lineage, and informed me that he still is not on speaking terms with the rest of the family. He then bought me a croissant.
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I met him. He was pretty rude. I told him to "get bent," and the rest is history.
__________________
Dave Gamble
Grove City, OH
RV-6 N466PG Purchased already flying - SOLD!
The Book: The PapaGolf Chronicles
Built RV-12
http://www.schmetterlingaviation.com
The Book: Being written.
The above web blogs and any links provided thereto are not instructional or advisory in nature. They merely seek to share my experiences in building and flying Van's RV airplanes.
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03-07-2011, 12:26 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 461
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A new entry to the recommended tools list!
Let me copy some text from my blog to share my experience I had with the longeron dies in action. One longeron I abused with a mallet, the other one was done with the dies. The short summary is: I consider these dies at least a recommended tool if not a required one.
"I had finished the left one before and now it was time to do the right one - this time with the help of the bending dies I had received a few days before. A first trial fit session where I used a piece of scrap cut off the longeron showed that the back die (the one without the cut out for the flange) was too tight. I filed it a bit wider and polished it with a SB pad to allow for easier removal of the angle after bending. I also added a marker on both dies that indicate the center line where the bend is being added for easier positioning with the markers on the flange of the longeron.
I was first worried that I wouldn't have that much control over the bend as with the mallet (well, 'control' is not a good word here) as I couldn't immediately verify the shape with the template while the longeron is in the vise. The dies make a direct positioning impossible and I had to remove the longeron after each bend to check if it turned out ok. I did this by clamping it into my second, smaller vise attached to the second work bench. Although this sounds awkward and slow, it turned out to be way superior over the mallet "method". And that is because I never had to go back to a previously bent spot. There's no vertical bend when using the dies. I checked it multiple times and there just wasn't anything to remove! I also developed a good feel for how much pressure was needed to accomplish a certain bend angle and so I hardly had to rebend a particular spot.
After the procedure the longeron looks pretty good. Not like it was salvaged from a shot down plane like the other one did. And it matched the template better than the mallet-treated one, too.
It took me 1.75 hours to bend the center area and the aft 4 degree angle, including the weight reduction cut. Boy, I so wish I had had those dies when doing the left longeron!"
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03-07-2011, 04:36 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Webster, NY
Posts: 91
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The Dies Work Great
I received my dies this Saturday. On Sunday ( with no previous longeron bending experience) we knocked out both longerons in about 90 minutes. I have previous metal working experience, but the dies make the process quit easy in my opinion.
i would hate to put the inventor out of business but why can't we have a few sets around for builders to use and pass on to the next builder for the price of shipping? Unless you are building more than 1 aircraft you should not need them again.
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