Extent of E-LSA compliance required?

cattflight · #1 06-07-2010, 04:05 PM

So, in reviewing the RV-12 E-LSA info on Van's website, I see this statement mentioning compliance:

"Although the E-LSA category does not permit builders to deviate from the kit or plans (no unapproved engines, propellers, etc. are allowed) it does have some very attractive features...."

Does this mean that the builder cannot deviate AT ALL from ANY element of the kit or plan? For instance, if I had some old King radios and some boat cushions I wanted to use instead of the Garmin stack and Vans interior, would that be considered a deviation? Likewise, what if I wanted to include an Aera GPS instead of the x96?

And, does the builder have to buy everything new from Vans? What if I got a great deal on second hand version of the exact models incuded in the plans? Is this allowed?

Just trying to get a better handle on the E-LSA, S-LSA and E-AB differentiators. Thanks!

kaceyd9plus · #2 06-07-2010, 04:50 PM

You MUST buy ALL kits from Vans Aircraft and install them per the plans or the aircraft will not be in compliance.
No product substitutions allowed.

Mel · #3 06-07-2010, 05:12 PM

No deviations from the plans, period!

rvbuilder2002 · #4 06-07-2010, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cattflight

And, does the builder have to buy everything new from Vans? What if I got a great deal on second hand version of the exact models incuded in the plans? Is this allowed?

Just trying to get a better handle on the E-LSA, S-LSA and E-AB differentiators. Thanks!

There is a lot of older posts in the RV-12 forum for you to read through.

The basic issue is that once you have bought a complete kit they supply you with a form 8130-15 form certifying that they supplied you with all of the parts and instructions for you to construct an RV-12 just the S-LSA prototype. After that it is your responsibility to build it exactly per the plans and then you will have to sign the form certifying you did so.

It is not possible for Van's to supply you with the 8130-15, if they can not confirm that you have the exact parts you are supposed to have.

cattflight · #5 06-07-2010, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rvbuilder2002

There is a lot of older posts in the RV-12 forum for you to read through.

The basic issue is that once you have bought a complete kit they supply you with a form 8130-15 form certifying that they supplied you with all of the parts and instructions for you to construct an RV-12 just the S-LSA prototype. After that it is your responsibility to build it exactly per the plans and then you will have to sign the form certifying you did so.

It is not possible for Van's to supply you with the 8130-15, if they can not confirm that you have the exact parts you are supposed to have.

Got it. No deviations whatsoever. So that would explain the E-AB designation on an RV12 with a three blade prop on Barnstormers. Thanks.

Jamie · #6 06-07-2010, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cattflight

Got it. No deviations whatsoever. So that would explain the E-AB designation on an RV12 with a three blade prop on Barnstormers. Thanks.

There are no deviations whatsoever for certification. There are quite a few E-LSA RV-12's that have been modified after they were certified (although I'm uncertain as to what level they can be modified and the requisite sign-offs). I know this process was discussed quite a bit here in the past. I would bet that searching the old posts here would give you more data on this.

Mel · #7 06-07-2010, 08:28 PM

an RV-12, E-LSA may be modified in any way as long as the modification does not take the aircraft beyond light-sport parameters. Anything that makes the aircraft too heavy, too fast, or with too high "clean" stall speed is a no-no.
If the aircraft has been modified so as to exceed light-sport parameters, the airworthiness certificate is no longer valid and it is not eligible for re-certification.

Mark Henderson · #8 06-07-2010, 11:12 PM

I have a bit of trouble with the concept of no deviations at all. From the time my first kit arrived, Vans has continued to make changes. The Adel clamps over the rudder tubes have been replaced with a metal guide. LP4-3 rivets have been changed to LP4-4's. The early kits didn't come with autopilot brackets, now they do. There are lots of other small changes. But they are deviations none the less. So how does one define if your RV-12 is exactly like the prototype, when you don't know what is in the prototype. I doubt that Vans went through a new certification with the FAA when these changes were made. Just my 2 cents.

rvbuilder2002 · #9 06-07-2010, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Henderson

I doubt that Vans went through a new certification with the FAA when these changes were made. Just my 2 cents.

They don't have too.
The rules require that any deviation from the plans be approved by van's.
So, if Van's issues the deviation, then it is approved. A builder just can't choose to make deviations on there own without approval.