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01-26-2010, 08:55 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Louisville, Ga
Posts: 7,840
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Cubic dollars...
..are the rest of the equation.
The few years I helped with my boss's -51 showed me early on that it was the really deep pockets/sponsorships that made the most speed, as in motorports. If you have a waaaaay larger than average money source, go for it, otherwise it could be nothing more than an idea....and there are many of those out there that failed.
Best,
__________________
Pierre Smith
RV-10, 510 TT
RV6A (Sojourner) 180 HP, Catto 3 Bl (502Hrs), gone...and already missed
Air Tractor AT 502B PT 6-15 Sold
Air Tractor 402 PT-6-20 Sold
EAA Flight Advisor/CFI/Tech Counselor
Louisville, Ga
It's never skill or craftsmanship that completes airplanes, it's the will to do so,
Patrick Kenny, EAA 275132
Dues gladly paid!
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01-26-2010, 09:17 AM
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Mendon South Carolina
Posts: 1,391
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael White
Bill,
The Legend was originally designed around a liquid cooled V8, hence the radiator scoop. IIRC, there were problems with the V8...don't remember exactly if they were cooling issues or reliability issues...that led to the installation of the turbine. Most Legend builders have either reduced the size of the scoop, faired it over or removed it entirely as it is no longer needed.
Best,
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At the time the legend was designed and kit production started the cost of the V8/PSRU skyrocketed well beyond projections. At the same time the Walter Turbines were plentiful and cheap by comparison.
The molds were already made and several kits produced when the decision was made which is why the scoop stayed.
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Milt Concannon
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01-26-2010, 09:21 AM
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Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Taylor Texas
Posts: 811
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Sport class
Yes, cubic dollars availability is a factor, but it is a much smaller factor when you participate in the Sport Class venue. The years I raced, I flew there, raced, and flew home with no worries. Heck, I'd bet at least 75% of the Sport class racers do this, or at least expect to. The course is at 5000'MSL, so without forced induction, you can't even get to 100% power. As I recall, I saw 26"MP while turning 2600RPM, ~21GPH, and the ASI showed ~195KIAS; this was good enough for 4th in the Bronze race. Temps/pressures stayed in the green the whole time, so I wasn't worried about the engine. In fact, Doug R is still flying that engine, and I don't think it's had more than oil & plug changes since then.
So, Sport class racing can be done without spending your $$$ by the shoebox full. SARL racing, done at generally lower altitudes, is probably more stress on the normally aspirated engines than Reno, tho we have seen no racing related engine problems to date.
I expect that for the Super Sport participants, the cubic dollar factor is a few steps higher, tho the scale could be logarithmic, kinda like the earthquake scale. I don't think I will ever get far enough into the program to find that answer!
Unlimited? Not in my future, or my wallet, but they sure are a kick to watch, as are the other classes.
Carry on!
Mark
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01-26-2010, 10:04 AM
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: OKC, OK
Posts: 687
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The Legend...
What I see in your drawing looks alot like the "Legend". The Legend used to be powered by a 572ci Rodeck big block, about 580 crank HP if I remember right. It was clean as an ice pick, and SUPER nice to fly. I was a bit saddened to see the Rodeck get replaced by the Walter M601 turbine, even though the Walter is more powerful, etc its just not the same as flying behind that huge V8.
If you can get your hands on one of these, it can be flown with the Walter or you could probably refit it with the V8. I think the plane was designed to take 1000HP in the nose. Lots and lots of carbon in that airframe. www.turbinelegend.com
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?The important thing in aeroplanes is that they shall be speedy.?
- Baron Manfred von Richthofen
RV8 under construction
RV4 - Sold
United B777 FO, Chicago
Aero Engineer
RV8
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01-26-2010, 10:51 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Mojave
Posts: 4,652
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeeBeeFan
... My ideas are pretty far out there and the deeper I get into this the clearer it is becoming that I need to totally redesign the entire aircraft...
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Stop in here and poke around... http://www.homebuiltairplanes.com/forums/
Lots of good info!
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WARNING! Incorrect design and/or fabrication of aircraft and/or components may result in injury or death. Information presented in this post is based on my own experience - Reader has sole responsibility for determining accuracy or suitability for use.
Michael Robinson
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Harmon Rocket II -SDS EFI
RV-8 - SDS CPI
1940 Taylorcraft BL-65
1984 L39C
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01-26-2010, 11:44 AM
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Forum Peruser
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Austinville, Alabama
Posts: 2,458
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Bugatti Veyron W16
I'm surprised someone hasn't mentioned the Bugatti Veyron W16 engine. With 1000 hp and four turbochargers, who cares how much it costs or how much it weighs? It'd definitely turn heads at the run-up pad!
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Don Hull
RV-7 Wings
KDCU Pryor Field
Pilots'n Paws Pilot
N79599/ADS-B In and Out...and I like it!
?Certainly, travel is more than the seeing of sights;
it is a change that goes on, deep and permanent, in the ideas of living." Miriam Beard
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01-26-2010, 02:17 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: S21, Oregon
Posts: 161
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I don't care too much for the sound of the Veyron, so I'll take it's little brother, the W12. Even made a post about it HERE
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Kelly
RV-7 empennage done, wings done, fuselage to QB stage.
1973 Maule M4-220C flying
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01-26-2010, 07:12 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: TX32
Posts: 1,891
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Its all about: Kerosene!
I just passed 1000 reliable hours in my Rocket with a standard aircraft engine with plenty of power producing stellar performance. If you're going to bolt a non-standard engine in a Rocket why not go with modern technology: JET power! A turboprop generates 4 times more HP per pound than a piston engine and is far superior in reliability.
Having spent alot of time over very cold water and bad guy land on one engine I can tell you what I would go with...
Smokey
HR2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swhSL...eature=related
Last edited by smokyray : 01-26-2010 at 07:14 PM.
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01-27-2010, 11:34 AM
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Pasadena CA
Posts: 2,484
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'Cause reno doesn't like turboprops. I understand where this is coming from, but from someone else that's done Reno (and probably will be 're'building something in the next 5 years to race...) it's WAY more than one guy can tackle. To do it right you need an airframe (easy part), money (sponsors? don't count on it, unless you can find a private one), and a crew that is as knowledgeable about the airplane as the builder.
And an engine guy
And money
Oh yeah, and two weeks of vacation in September for the whole crew...
__________________
Stephen Samuelian, CFII, A&P IA, CTO
RV4 wing in Jig @ KPOC
RV7 emp built
Last edited by osxuser : 01-27-2010 at 11:35 AM.
Reason: English>me
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01-27-2010, 04:41 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 2,125
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GBF:
The artist's concept sure looks great...it'll be purty, that's for sure!
I saw Tom's recommendation to look at Mark's newest F1 design, and was thinking the same thing. If Mark feels it could handle the V8, then it may be worth considering...very sleek and strong airframe starting point! And I don't think the ever-humble Boss mentioned in this thread that it may have an option for retractable gear...so that might catch your eye as well.
Fitting the engine might be a hurdle, as you alluded to in the first post. Mark's thought that it's not as far a leap as putting a 540 in an 8 (or in my case in a 6 [bought flying with the big motor]), is encouraging. I have a buddy in Vegas that is building a Thorp, redesigned to be a single seater for racing. His initial plan was to go with the LS1, but due to physical size limitations, he's opting for a souped-up V6. Don't have more specifics, but he's talking pretty big HP...short of an LS1, but pretty impressive. The Thorp is an interesting starting point for the project in terms of clean racing lines, but he built and flies a T-18 and likes the airframe. I think starting with a Rocket will put you out in front from the git go!
I like Smokey's TP idea too...if you could make it fit, a PT-6 or Walter-powered F1 would purr like a kitten and eat up sky like a lion! But as Steve said, it puts you out of the standard RARA classes.
Of course there's always the Thunder Mustang with it's Falconer 12-banger. John Parker down the street at American Air Racing has a stocker for sale for just $675 large! Cool, but yikes!
Good luck, it'll be fun to watch your racer's development!
Cheers,
Bob
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