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  #11  
Old 02-15-2006, 05:42 PM
jany77 jany77 is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: monterey ,ca
Posts: 105
Default 2x 3x

thanks alot guys i did some back riveting with sioux 2x and i liked it but when im reading the plans there is lots of big 4- rivets so i think ill go with 3x gun thanks alot
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  #12  
Old 02-15-2006, 06:54 PM
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13brv3 13brv3 is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Tellico Plains, TN
Posts: 561
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by plaurence
Gee Rusty,

An eight , a 3 and another eight?

Two and a half years later, I'm just finishing my wings!

Peter Laurence
RV9A
Now that sounds like a personal problem

The first -8 was a standard kit, and took 2.5 years to build. The -3 was an almost complete structure that I bought from someone who never finished it. I did have to retrofit -3B QB wings to it when I found that the original builder made some life threatening mistakes on the spars. Still, most of my time was spent on the Mazda engine conversion (multiple revisions of it), but that was what I considered the fun part. The new -8 is QB all the way, and my plan is to have it flying before the end of this year. Piece of cake
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RV-8, SN-80587, built, flown, sold.
RV-3B, SN-10751, rotary engine, built, flown, sold
RV-8, SN-82470, built, flown, sold.
RV-3B, SN-11351, purchased, , flown, sold
A&P - 2018
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  #13  
Old 02-18-2006, 04:00 AM
Pirkka Pirkka is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Europe, Finland (EFTU)
Posts: 542
Default

Still wondering: at least the ads say that 2X guns are capable for 1/8" rivets but some of you say that they don't. Why would any "RV tool seller" even offer you 2X guns as an option for 3X if it isn't adequate for the job. Some of you however admit that both will do just fine.

Just visited a guy building 7A and he had used 2X so far without problems. Therefore good 2X rivet gun with adequate pressures should do just fine for RVs?

You can always say that regulator allows to drop down the pressure then why don't take 7X if that is the issue...
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- RV-7 -
Tail: Waiting for fiberglass.
Wings: Some priming left, then lot of riveting.
QB Fuse + Finishing kit: in crates.
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  #14  
Old 02-18-2006, 06:10 AM
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Rick6a Rick6a is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Lake St. Louis, MO.
Posts: 2,346
Default Not worth a debate

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pirkka
...........the ads say that 2X guns are capable for 1/8" rivets but some of you say that they don't............. Some of you however admit that both will do just fine.............
You will not be disappointed purchasing a 3X rivet gun. Personally, I've never been a fan of regulating the air pressure on any rivet gun but then I pounded rivets for a living and it is as second nature to me as breathing. I recommend a 3X for the homebuilder because it allows (if needed for your own personal comfort level), to regulate the air pressure downward to shoot a 3/32" rivet but then have adequate reserves to open it up to shoot 1/8" rivets. The problem with a 2X's rivet gun overall utility becomes glaringly apparent in those situations in which you might have to use a long 1/8" rivet set. If the rivet set happens to be a long offset shooting a long length 1/8" rivet, then the chances are very good the 2X will simply not have the muscle to handle the job. The longer the rivet set and/or the more offset it has, the more energy is dissipated before ever reaching the rivet. Further, longer length rivets require considerably more energy to set than shorter length rivets. A few times in my RV construction experience, I was even glad I have a 4X in my tool box to use. I think this whole debate thing with the 2X vs. 3X centers on the fact many guys base their opinion on their (limited) experience with the shorter length rivets used in the empennage kit, then get on-line and sing their happy praises. Well into the fuselage or final kit, they may well run into a situation in which they have to set a relatively long 1/8" rivet using a long rivet set. When that awkward moment of realization is upon them, they will likely experience a personal ephiphany of sorts and then quietly proceed to cast about in search of a 3X rivet gun to borrow or buy.

Rick Galati RV-6A "Darla"
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  #15  
Old 02-18-2006, 06:47 AM
Highflight Highflight is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 472
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pirkka
Still wondering: at least the ads say that 2X guns are capable for 1/8" rivets but some of you say that they don't. Why would any "RV tool seller" even offer you 2X guns as an option for 3X if it isn't adequate for the job. Some of you however admit that both will do just fine.

Just visited a guy building 7A and he had used 2X so far without problems. Therefore good 2X rivet gun with adequate pressures should do just fine for RVs?

You can always say that regulator allows to drop down the pressure then why don't take 7X if that is the issue...
All good points made about the 3X gun, but QB builders like us can happily sing along with the 2X. Go here and play the "Choosing 2X or 3X Rivet Gun" video. It might be helpful.

http://www5.mailordercentral.com/clevtool/faq.asp

One of the final suggestions in that video is to use the smallest rivet gun for the job. In the case of our QB kits and the rivet sizes needed to finish them, the 2X is clearly the best first choice.
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Mattituck IO-360 (AFP) w/2 P-mags
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  #16  
Old 02-18-2006, 07:32 AM
jcoloccia jcoloccia is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,110
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pirkka
Still wondering: at least the ads say that 2X guns are capable for 1/8" rivets but some of you say that they don't. Why would any "RV tool seller" even offer you 2X guns as an option for 3X if it isn't adequate for the job. Some of you however admit that both will do just fine.
The 2X WILL set 1/8 rivets, however it's HARD. You've got to crank the pressure, and keep it on the rivet a long time. The stupid thing hits so fast it reminds me of that old football game where the game board vibrates and the magnetic men randomly go around in circles and bump into each other. With all this going on, it's difficult to keep the bucking bar and gun straight, especially when you have to do it for, like, 3 seconds (or more). Also, it's very easy to work harden the rivet if you screw it up even just a tiny bit. Very fine line between driving and work hardening.

So it is possible, but I have a 3X and have been very happy. Before I started building, I hung out with an A&P and picked his brain for a few hours. Once I saw the 2X vs 3X in action, 3X was a no brainer. Just my opinion.
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Former builder, but still lurking 'cause you're a pretty cool bunch...
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