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  #21  
Old 02-07-2009, 05:44 AM
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Noah Noah is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Rhode Island
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For those who have mounted a heavy counterweighted angle valve engine like the A1B6 that I'm hanging along with a heavy Hartzell prop on a 7A, what did you have to do to keep the CG in range? Move the battery? If so, how far? Other considerations?
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Noah F, RV-7A

All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men? for they may act their dream with open eyes, to make it possible. -T.E. Lawrence
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  #22  
Old 02-07-2009, 07:51 AM
Scott Hersha Scott Hersha is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posts: 1,558
Default Whirlwind

Quote:
The 3 bladed 151, has a TBO of 350 hrs or 5 years. It is a few knots slower but performs a bit better in climb (according to Whirwind!) This one needs the pressure setting to be much higher than the standard MT governor, but maybe the governor can handle it and just needs to be set at the higher pressure. Give Whirwind a call, they maybe able to advise on this
Don't know how to pick parts from previous posts to reference, but this is the best I could do.... the previous quote is from Tony. I did a pretty valid comparison between a 150 series Whirlwind and their 200RV. I originally had the Whirlwind 150 on my RV-6 and had some trouble with the hub spitting grease (which they've now fixed). Greg gave me a good deal on trading in my 150 for a 200RV. I flew to Austinburg in the morning, Greg and I made the prop swap and I flew home the same day. Here's what was immediately apparent: initial acceleration and initial climb rate was noticeably better with the 150. Once the airspeed got above 100 KIAS the climb difference narrowed. At 8500 feet using the same power setting (wide open throttle, 2400 RPM) the true airspeed was 8 knots faster with the 200RV v.s. the 150. They don't sell the 150 anymore, having replace the wide 150 blades with the narrower higher aspect ration 151 blades. You will see similar, but less dramatic differences with the 151 v.s. the 200RV. Cruise speed will be about 4-5 knots faster with the 200RV and acceleration and INITIAL climb less(although I still get airborne solo on a cold day in less than 500 feet and cruise climb - 120 KIAS- at 1500 - 1800 fpm). I was happy enough with Whirlwind and Greg Anderson to buy a 200RV for my new RV-8. The 200RV has a large McCauley-clone hub and any governor should work, although the jhistrol they sell is a very good one at a good price and works well with the 151 which requires high pressure (about 425 psi).

Scott
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  #23  
Old 02-08-2009, 06:31 AM
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Noah Noah is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Rhode Island
Posts: 937
Default Serviceability

Some have argued against the Whirlwind because of the limited locations available to service the prop as compared to the Hartzell. Can anybody comment on exactly how many shops there are which can service these and where they are located? Getting stuck somewhere for a week because I can't get my prop fixed doesn't sound like fun.

Having said that, the 200RV hub is a McCauley (not sure if its stock or mods are made), and I assume that the prop blade roots are machined to be identical to McCauley roots. With this information, can one assume that most prop shops would at least be familiar enough with the prop (hub and blade root) that they could service at least a good portion of potential problems which could arise?

The "experimental" nature of the prop is another matter, and "3rd party" prop shops concerns about liability (or not having the prop manuals) might prevent them from working on them.

Can anybody shed any light on this angle of the comparison?
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Noah F, RV-7A

All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men? for they may act their dream with open eyes, to make it possible. -T.E. Lawrence
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  #24  
Old 02-08-2009, 01:17 PM
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rickrv8 rickrv8 is online now
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Eagle, CO
Posts: 84
Default Sensenich

Quote:
Originally Posted by Noah View Post
Can anybody comment on exactly how many shops there are which can service these and where they are located?
Noah,

I had a 200C and now a 200RV on my RV-8. I had Sensenich Propeller in Pennsylvania perform a service bulletin change (before the sale of Whirlwind to Titan in Ohio). They were more than happy to work on the propeller.

I also shipped my prop back to Greg in Ohio to exchange the C blades for the RV blades. Their turn around time was exceptionally fast. I simply shipped the prop by UPS. No issues at all.
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Rick McBride
Eagle, CO
RV-6 Built and Sold
RV-8 Built and Flying
RV-10 Under Construction
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  #25  
Old 02-08-2009, 09:28 PM
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N130WN N130WN is offline
 
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The 5 year TBO begins with first engine start, I assume. No?



Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilottonny View Post
Greg,

I spoke to Greg at Whirwind, the 200RV is for the O-320 and O-360. No restructions on either engine, including FI and El. Ign. It works with the Van's MT governor.

The TBO is actually 650 hrs. or 5 years and can be done by a Mc. Cauley propeller shop (if they want to work on an experimental propeller ofcourse), because its hub is similar/the same.

...

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Larry Bowen
RV-8 Built, sold, missed.
RV-7 Built, sold, missed.
RV-8 Emp in progress ...
RV-8A Purchased, flying.
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  #26  
Old 02-09-2009, 12:01 AM
Pilottonny Pilottonny is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Belgium
Posts: 645
Default 5 year TBO

I do hope so, it may take an other year before I am flying.

Regards, Tonny
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"Pilottonny"
Tonny Tromp
Lanaken, Belgium (EU)
RV9A, Registration: PH-VAN
ECI-Titan IOX-320 with dual EI, turning a Whirlwind 200RV CS prop.
Sold
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  #27  
Old 02-09-2009, 11:24 AM
Pilottonny Pilottonny is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Belgium
Posts: 645
Thumbs up Group buy: 13 orders are in!

Spoke to Kevin, from American Propeller, today. There are 13 orders at this moment and I am probably going for it as well (awaiting shipping quote). So the price is at $ 7.400,- already.

Gees...... forgot to ask about the start of the TBO-time. Well.... will have to do that next time.

Regards, Tonny.
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"Pilottonny"
Tonny Tromp
Lanaken, Belgium (EU)
RV9A, Registration: PH-VAN
ECI-Titan IOX-320 with dual EI, turning a Whirlwind 200RV CS prop.
Sold
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  #28  
Old 02-09-2009, 06:33 PM
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Kevin Horton Kevin Horton is offline
 
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Location: Ottawa, Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaRomeo View Post
...by Larry Vetterman (before he did his cowl mod thingy). He emailed me that he has all the data on the two props and will write something up next week (or so).
If I read Larry's post correctly, he tested the Hartzell with the 7496 blades, not the 7497.
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Kevin Horton
RV-8
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http://www.kilohotel.com/rv8/
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  #29  
Old 02-09-2009, 07:03 PM
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jthocker jthocker is offline
 
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Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Horton View Post
If I read Larry's post correctly, he tested the Hartzell with the 7496 blades, not the 7497.
Good! I'm kinda behind on my beer making, so maybe Scott and I can provide some useful info after all.
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Jon Thocker
Habitual Offender
RV4, RV4, RV6A, RV8, RV8, RV8,RV8, RV8, RV8, RV12
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  #30  
Old 02-10-2009, 09:24 PM
C-GRVT C-GRVT is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 305
Default How important is propeller weight?

In deciding on a prop, how important is weight as a factor? A Hartzell is clearly a heavy choice compared to a Whirlwind. At every opportunity, Van suggests light is better. Effort is made to reduce airframe weight at every opportunity - a few grams here and there, lightening hole in the battery box, corners shaved off brake pedal angles, lightweight seats......
Why not the same concern about 20 lbs or so of weight in the prop? Why isn't that a huge deal, or is it? Some posters refer to different handling characteristics, but never having flown as RV, light or heavy, is that just an observation, or a criticism of the flying qualities of a heavy prop RV? I realize this is perhaps a subjective thing, but thoughts of those that have experienced both would be valuable.
I notice as well that Van's is now (wihout any fanfare) offering a Hartzell composite prop for the O-360. Anyone have any thoughts about that prop? I assume that it is lighter in weight (definitely heavier in the wallet) than the Hartzell aluminum prop.
Bill Brooks
Ottawa, Canada
RV-6A in progress
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