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09-29-2008, 08:37 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 145
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Use Blind Rivets?
For my RV-9, after looking at the contortions that would be required to drive those rivets attaching the LE to the spar, I asked Van's whether blind rivets can be used. Here is their answer:
"It is acceptable to attach the leading edge ribs to the spar with LP4-3 or LP4-
4 blind rivets. Be sure to use the proper grip length rivet for the material
thickness."
...Joe
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09-30-2008, 11:45 AM
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Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 51
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First real frustration
Kelly, I had the same problem and same frustration. For me part of the solution was Blue Bell coffee flavor.
2 of my middle ribs on the first wing looked just like yours. Repeated attempts kept comming out the same way.
I called Vans and asked about using nut plates on the second wing's rib flanges and screws through the spar. They were ok with it as long as I was ok with the extra weight(2 rivits, nutplate, screw and washer per 1/8" rivit hole). Wish I had done it sooner instead of fretting over it for a week.
Vic
RV-8 Wings and tail done. Working on Fuse.
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09-30-2008, 12:21 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Hamilton, New Zealand
Posts: 632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by az_gila
"hold the set and gun with two hands (partner bucking)"
This really does make a difference - a lot of builders are reluctant to actually hold the set while bucking, but it helps with these offset sets...
If you don't, the set starts to rotate and everything goes to h*&^ quickly, and smileys grow... 
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Which is why, when working single handed with the offset set, duct tape around it is really useful to stop the set from rotating. Mind you, I only do this if I absolutely must; as long as I can wait for assistance, I'll wait so I can then use both hands. I hate that offset set. Stupid thing.
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09-30-2008, 12:41 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Bay Village, OH
Posts: 886
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Two hands
I've had very little help. But where it really made a difference was on these -4's. Gotta hold the set in one hand, gun in the other. If you need to, get a different helper, politically correctly, of course. The Avery set protectors worked for me too, but I suspect a lot of that is mental; they are a bigger help when there is a inexperienced helper on the gun.
I do differ with some gun comments. The rivet forming gets done by the bucking bar. My tungsten bucking bar was rec'd about halfway through these, and it made a world of difference. I haven't has a place where a 2x at 60 psi wasn't sufficient, but I've also got a regulated header tank (10 gal) and only use 10' of hose to my tools. This stuff matters.
I also have some cherry structural rivets in some of these holes, generally closest to the spar flange, out of frustration. And some smiley ones. And a rib doink or two. An extra dab of primer and it all disappears. You're in a lot of company.
Build on!
Rick
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09-30-2008, 02:25 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Cumming, GA
Posts: 610
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Ah yes, remember those rivets well. I had tendonitis in my riveting arm for months after that. Riveting and reaching don't mix...
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09-30-2008, 03:21 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 659
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I bucked those while my wife drove them in. We used a 10" extension in my rivet gun. We found that keeping the set as straight as possible and using plenty of force would keep the rivets looking nice.
Holding the set in place never hurts either. It took us a while to get over the fear of touching the set while the rivet gun was pounding.
__________________
Andy Compton, PhD EE
RV-10 - #41414 (building)
RV-9A - N643AC (built,flying,sold,missed)
My blood and sweat, the Wifey's tears
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09-30-2008, 04:12 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 2,473
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geico266
Get your hands on a 3X gun for the larger rivets.
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Ditto what Larry said.
or even my favorite - a 4x....you can always turn the air pressure down on the bigger guns. I think you'll find that most people who've shot lots of rivets prefer a 3 or 4 - not I many I know prefer a 2.
Lots of other good advice as well. Mel makes a good point about holding the offset sets - almost a must do.
My 2 cents as usual.
Cheers,
Stein
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09-30-2008, 05:06 PM
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: central oregon
Posts: 1,089
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1:1 Scale
I've ordered up some 12" drill bits and a 3/32" and 1/8" punch, and have a friend that has a "2X gun with a 3X piston" that he really likes and is going to send me to try. I'll also try the duct tape in the tip and around the spring. I had tried holding the set on the second and third rivets, and they were getting better, but I think we just worked on them too much in the end.
Scott, I bought the set second hand, but it has "1/8" 470" stamped on it, so I'm pretty sure it's the right set
I guess I'll dimple ribs and prep the top skins for riveting until the tools get here  Sucks waking up at 2AM to the thought of "rivet defeat" though 
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Hey Kelly,
I've got a 3x gun, 12 '' bits and snap socs. give me a call if you want to use them, i've been busy building some barns. I'll be out of town in november.
danny (bend)
i've also got the tungsten bars if you want to use them
Last edited by Danny7 : 09-30-2008 at 05:11 PM.
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10-01-2008, 09:44 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: S21, Oregon
Posts: 161
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Thanks Danny, I'll be calling you next week for the 3x gun and a trigger man 
__________________
Kelly
RV-7 empennage done, wings done, fuselage to QB stage.
1973 Maule M4-220C flying
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