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  #1  
Old 03-17-2019, 07:51 AM
KeithB's Avatar
KeithB KeithB is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Granbury, TX
Posts: 268
Default Lycoming IO-390 C series - cold air induction

I posted this under the ?Superior Buy Back? thread and got no responses - I?m hoping it just got buried.

Lycoming offers a 390 with cold air induction - C3B6 model rated at 215 HP (available on the Cirrus SR20 for example). Vans does not offer this (it must be A3B6) and I suspect this is because the Lycoming cold air induction sump (like the Superior XP-400 sump) is lower and would interfere with the crossover exhaust (4 in 1) designed for the RV14. However, for my Superior XP400, I substituted a Vetterman trombone system (2x 2-in-1) which does not cross under the sump. Has anyone installed or investigated the C3B6 IO-390 (Thunderbolt, non-certified) engine for an RV-14? I realize I would face changes in cables (throttle and maybe mixture) but I?m more concerned with intake and exhaust pipe spacing and clearing the sump itself.
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Keith Brown

RV-14A Builder - kit #136
N314KC - First flight Mar 8, 2017, 24th in the air, >600 hrs
XP-400 Aero Sport Power, replaced with Lyc Thunderbolt 390
RV-6A sold
Sport Pilot (weight-shift control) - Airborne XT912
Dues paid 9/2020
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  #2  
Old 03-17-2019, 09:16 AM
Salter Salter is offline
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Elberta, AL
Posts: 56
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Following this thread. Keith I met you at OSH 2 years ago. Buddy of mine was parked in front of you in a 9A that was still in silver at the time like yours.
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emp & wings complete
fuselage in progress
N70C reserved
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  #3  
Old 03-17-2019, 09:37 AM
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jeffw@sc47 jeffw@sc47 is offline
 
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Location: Simpsonville, SC (SC47)
Posts: 312
Default Cold sump option TB IO390

I looked at this as a possibllity rather the warm air sump two years ago.

I found that would require unspecified modifications to control cables, possibly the exhaust pipes, and possibly others.

I was also informed that it is a considerable cost increase of (my memory says) around $6K.
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Simpsonville, SC (@SC47 > 10nm NW Triple Tree)
1946 Bellanca Cruisair 14-13-2 (73 YRS OLD 8/15/19)
RV14A (N14ZT), Ser#140195
Start 10/11/14
Dues paid 12/1/19 (USArmy 2/67-2/70)
www.mykitlog.com/jeffw@sc47
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  #4  
Old 03-17-2019, 03:03 PM
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KeithB KeithB is offline
 
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Location: Granbury, TX
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Hi Jeff:

Similar info here so far - although I?m facing the same issues with the stock IO-390 - exhaust pipes and control cables. As for price, the biggest part of the difference is that the C3B6 is NOT on the Van?s price list so you face list price.
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Keith Brown

RV-14A Builder - kit #136
N314KC - First flight Mar 8, 2017, 24th in the air, >600 hrs
XP-400 Aero Sport Power, replaced with Lyc Thunderbolt 390
RV-6A sold
Sport Pilot (weight-shift control) - Airborne XT912
Dues paid 9/2020
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  #5  
Old 05-12-2020, 05:47 PM
paszekj paszekj is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: West Des Moines, IA
Posts: 23
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Hi Kieth,
Thought I?d check to see what you found out. I have a Thunderbolt IO390 that just arrived. I remember asking about cold air induction and was told that it wasn?t an option (from Lycoming). I?m researching a couple other options such as Superior or Sky Dynamics and planning to use Vetterman exhaust. I?m hoping it can be accomplished without too much modification to the lower cowl. Any advice anyone has would be appreciated.
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West Des Moines, Iowa
RV 14A
Empennage, Wings, Fuselage done at Synergy Air South. Working on Finish Kit. Planning on SDS EFI.
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  #6  
Old 05-12-2020, 07:55 PM
mikeg mikeg is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
Posts: 7
Default IO-390 exhaust

We fabricated a custom 2-in-1 exhaust for each side, now a non-issue
All fits in my RV8-A with cold air induction and Air Flow performance induction
Looks and works fantastic
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RV-8A, IO-390
Surefly ignition
Air Flow Performance induction
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  #7  
Old 05-12-2020, 08:26 PM
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KeithB KeithB is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Granbury, TX
Posts: 268
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paszekj View Post
Hi Kieth,
Thought I?d check to see what you found out. I have a Thunderbolt IO390 that just arrived. I remember asking about cold air induction and was told that it wasn?t an option (from Lycoming). I?m researching a couple other options such as Superior or Sky Dynamics and planning to use Vetterman exhaust. I?m hoping it can be accomplished without too much modification to the lower cowl. Any advice anyone has would be appreciated.
I ended up going with a Thunderbolt IO390 purchased through Van?s, and swapped the Superior cold air induction sump from my XP400, allowing my exhaust and cables to all fit.
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Keith Brown

RV-14A Builder - kit #136
N314KC - First flight Mar 8, 2017, 24th in the air, >600 hrs
XP-400 Aero Sport Power, replaced with Lyc Thunderbolt 390
RV-6A sold
Sport Pilot (weight-shift control) - Airborne XT912
Dues paid 9/2020
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  #8  
Old 05-12-2020, 08:43 PM
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emsvitil emsvitil is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: SoCal
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Any pictures of the difference(s) between the two 390 model?
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  #9  
Old 05-12-2020, 09:14 PM
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DanH DanH is offline
 
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Location: 08A
Posts: 9,500
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There is unlikely to be a significant difference in induction air temperature between the standard forward induction, and the "cold air" sump.

The standard plenum intake does not pass induction air up through the hot oil like the updraft carb sump. It only has one hot surface (the plenum ceiling), "hot" being the sump oil temperature, perhaps 200F average. Both inductions are submerged in hot lower cowling air (120 to 180F in flight), and both have intake pipes running parallel to the exhaust headers.

If the new intake plenum actually nets better numbers on the dyno, I'd guess it is because of smaller plenum volume, i.e. intake wave tuning, not significantly reduced density.

The IO390C parts catalog is free for download at lycoming.com. Page 38 for the new sump.
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RV-8 SS
Barrett IO-390
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  #10  
Old 05-13-2020, 07:34 AM
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rv6ejguy rv6ejguy is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Calgary, Canada
Posts: 5,766
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Ashley Miller brought to my attention that the new 390 C and D sub types use RSA-10 size servos rather than RSA-5 which is interesting.

We find our 80mm throttles bodies (RSA-10 bolt pattern) on 540 engines produce no more manifold pressure past about 2/3rds throttle. With 150 less cubes, I'm not sure how much a 390 would benefit from such a large servo.
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Ross Farnham, Calgary, Alberta
Turbo Subaru EJ22, SDS EFI, Marcotte M-300, IVO, Shorai- RV6A C-GVZX flying from CYBW since 2003- 441.0 hrs. on the Hobbs,
RV10 95% built- Sold 2016
http://www.sdsefi.com/aircraft.html
http://sdsefi.com/cpi2.htm



Last edited by rv6ejguy : 05-13-2020 at 08:10 AM.
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