Tasks before attaching Cabin and Upper Forward Fuselage?

UnPossible · #1 01-31-2020, 07:45 AM

Hey - I am getting to the point where I am about ready to permanently attach the cabin top and rivet in the upper forward fuselage.

I have run all the heavy power wiring back to the batteries, and installed the refrigerant hoses for the AC system.

My question for those that have finished a 10, is there anything you really wish you would have completed before you attached the top, or riveted on the upper forward fuselage?

I'm trying to not paint my self into a corner, but it seems like I need to bite the bullet and move forward. One more question... once I have the top on, should I go ahead and install all the windows, or is better to wait a bit?

Thanks,
Jason

rocketman1988 · #2 01-31-2020, 08:10 AM

I wish that I would had cut the openings in the sub panel prior to installing the forward upper fuselage assembly. I waited and it was more challenging once the assembly is permanently attached.

Riveting the assembly is much easier without the engine mount attached; there are several rivets where it is difficult to position the rivet gun...

Install your firewall pass throughs while it is easy to get to them.

Install fans in the upper fuselage skin assembly if you want; easier now...

As far as the windows go, I left mine out for awhile. It is easier reaching through the openings and they are less likely to get scratched. Oh, it also was easier keeping the heat down inside the cabin during the summer months.

If I were building another -10, I would take a look at the sika flex route for the windows. I used the Lord adhesive and it was pretty easy and turned out fine...but...it is and off white color and you can see it through the window...yes, they make it in black but it only has an 8-10 minute work time...

RV10Pilot · #3 01-31-2020, 08:12 AM

You want to complete as much as you can inside the fuselage before you attach the cabin top. Fuel lines, break lines, paint the interior, cut the holes for de-fog fans and paint the glare shield (if you are doing that), etc. It's not that you can not do those tasks with the top on, it just makes it easier. At some point you just have to move on and deal with it.

You don't lose much access after the transparencies are installed, so when you do that is not as important. You do want the door windows and the strut installed before you make the final fit and fill between the door and the cabin top because there will be some shift.

You thought you had fun fitting the cabin top, the fun has just begun. Doors are coming soon!

9GT · #4 01-31-2020, 08:26 AM

Get the inside of the cabin cover filled and sanded for whatever you plan for the headliner, whether it be paint or a fabric. Also get the overhead console fitted if applicable. Its pretty spacious back there compared to the other RV models so its not a big deal to slither your way in the tail if needed,,,just be sure to support the tail at the tie down point in case you get too far back, you don't want it coming down and hitting the floor.

UnPossible · #5 01-31-2020, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocketman1988

I wish that I would had cut the openings in the sub panel prior to installing the forward upper fuselage assembly. I waited and it was more challenging once the assembly is permanently attached.

Riveting the assembly is much easier without the engine mount attached; there are several rivets where it is difficult to position the rivet gun...

Install your firewall pass throughs while it is easy to get to them.

Install fans in the upper fuselage skin assembly if you want; easier now...

Maybe a dumb question.... I am assuming that I won't be able to cut the openings in the sub panel until I have my instrument panel all designed and laid out? or are there some holes that are pretty universal?

As for the firewall pass throughs.... where is the best place on the FW for them to come through? On my 7A I had one on each side, fairly high. Is there a better place for the pass throughs on the 10?

rocketman1988 · #6 01-31-2020, 10:05 AM

Unfortunately, no really good answers.

The holes in the sub panel will depend on what instrument panel you intend to go with. I knew I was going to use the Aerosport symmetrical panel, and I knew I was going to use a GTN6xx, so that gave me an approximate location for the biggest hole. You only have about 9.5" between the instrument panel and sub panel. The IFR navigators are around 11" without counting the connectors and wiring, so you WILL need to cut a hole.

Realize that there is a slight angle to the instrument panel and the hole you cut will be lower than you think on the sub panel. If you are looking to put a IFR navigator low on the instrument panel, it will likely require cutting the lower flange of the sub panel. As the sub panel IS structural, you will need to find a way to reinforce this area to regain structural integrity...it is doable but takes more effort than just using a couple of angles or a doubler on the flat web of the sub panel.

The firewall pass throughs, will depend on what equipment you will be using. The CHT and EGT wiring will use most of a 3/4" pass through by themselves. I put that on in the firewall box near where the control cables go through.

I put another up high on the left side of the firewall for pretty much everything else. I am using the EFII System 32, so there are two additional firewall connectors, which I put on the right side.

"...so its not a big deal to slither your way in the tail if needed..."

You must be an average size person. I can tell you that it IS a big deal for those of us XL pilots! Luckily, my son had no issues getting back there.

A tip: Put a blanket or some carpet in the fuselage first, that way, when you drop a tool or heaven forbid a bucking bar, the damage to the fuselage skin will be much less...

UnPossible · #7 01-31-2020, 10:07 AM

I've got the cabin and the doors fitting well, planning on the final door fit after the cabin top is permanently attached.

I also have the overhead console bonded to the cabin top, and hope to paint the cabin top interior this weekend.

lr172 · #8 01-31-2020, 10:22 AM

I would complete your entire panel before installing the forward upper skin (mechanical, not necessarily electrical). Much easier to deal with mechanical mounnting issues and wire management h/w while either on the bench or removable.

You will find that you can cut, fit, etc. with iterations on and off the fuse. Much easier this way.

Also, be sure you are happy with the rudder pedals and everything in the forward tunnel section. I did RC servos and bowden cables for heat and this was easier as well with the top removable.

Larry

lr172 · #9 01-31-2020, 10:32 AM

comments in line below

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocketman1988

I wish that I would had cut the openings in the sub panel prior to installing the forward upper fuselage assembly. I waited and it was more challenging once the assembly is permanently attached.

a definate +1

Riveting the assembly is much easier without the engine mount attached; there are several rivets where it is difficult to position the rivet gun...

Install your firewall pass throughs while it is easy to get to them.

Install fans in the upper fuselage skin assembly if you want; easier now...

another +1 here. I used a doubler and this would have been a real pain if that assembly was rivetted on.

As far as the windows go, I left mine out for awhile. It is easier reaching through the openings and they are less likely to get scratched. Oh, it also was easier keeping the heat down inside the cabin during the summer months.

If I were building another -10, I would take a look at the sika flex route for the windows. I used the Lord adhesive and it was pretty easy and turned out fine...but...it is and off white color and you can see it through the window...yes, they make it in black but it only has an 8-10 minute work time...

Wiring and other tasks are much easier without side windows. Don't rush to install them. I used sikaflex and am happy. I can see the amount of movement in the acrylic / FG interface. It is a lot and the sika deals with it well. I painted over the sika and wouldn't recommend that approach. Better to leave it black as a transition (Jan did this and it looks very nice-has pics here). My paint already has stress cracks in a couple of the high movement area (appeared after first excursion below 30*). Doesn't look real bad, but ticks me off none the less. I would not trust a rigid adhesive, at least in the temp extremes seen in the midwest. Also learned it would be best to mount the windows at a 50* temp instead of 70, as I did. I get more contraction in the cold than I get bulging in the high temps. It will lay flat at the temp it cures at.

lr172 · #10 01-31-2020, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UnPossible

Maybe a dumb question.... I am assuming that I won't be able to cut the openings in the sub panel until I have my instrument panel all designed and laid out? or are there some holes that are pretty universal?

As for the firewall pass throughs.... where is the best place on the FW for them to come through? On my 7A I had one on each side, fairly high. Is there a better place for the pass throughs on the 10?

Several avionics (radios, GPS, etc.) will need to go through the sub-panel. Way easier to do this work on the bench. Also, you will need to lay out all of your misc modules on the sub-panel. Also, much easier on the bench.

Putting the top on needs to get done. However, the fwd top skin really does not need to be rivetted on until ready to do panel wiring. That skin/assembly can still come on and off even when the top is fully secured, assuming you don't attach the windshield and leave the support out until then.

Larry