AOA

[olyolson]

After research and discussing a solution with AFS and Mike Vaccaro it looks like the easiest solution to work with my touchscreen AFS 5500 & the Skyview network is below:

- Replace my heated pitot tube with the Dynon Pitot/AOA probe and install the heater/controller. Use existing wiring for the new pitot tube heater.

- Run an additional pitot line from the AOA port on the new probe all the way back to the Adhars. No additional wiring needed because the Adhars is already wired to the EFIS and working. When the EFIS senses the AOA it will display the AOA bracket in the upper left.

- Install a flap position sensor and wire into the EFIS to display flap position and allow AOA calibration points with the normal flaps down landing position and flaps up.

- AFS is working on a tone generator similar to Vac’s that will allow selection of this or the current “Angle-Angle-Push” audio tone.

- Complete the recommended AFS AOA calibration procedure

I think that covers the installation I’ve discussed with Rob at AFS. I could install Vac’s system but the AFS solution seems easier to implement without having to build the AOA computer box and I would still need the AOA probe anyway.

So if anyone has the new Dynon Pitot/AOA probe or the Ray Allen POS-12 flap position sensor not being used let me know. I am debating whether to start purchasing components or just leave everything as is. I would like to have AOA but don’t relish the cost or extra work & down time to do it.

[Pilot135pd]

Originally Posted by olyolson

So if anyone has the new Dynon Pitot/AOA probe or the Ray Allen POS-12 flap position sensor not being used let me know.

The Ray Allen POS-12 is the flap sensor needed for the RV-8? I have an order pending with Aircraft Spruce so I'd like to add it if that's the size I'll need too.

[Pilot135pd]

Originally Posted by olyolson

After research and discussing a solution with AFS and Mike Vaccaro it looks like the easiest solution to work with my touchscreen AFS 5500 & the Skyview network is below:

- Replace my heated pitot tube with the Dynon Pitot/AOA probe and install the heater/controller. Use existing wiring for the new pitot tube heater.

- Run an additional pitot line from the AOA port on the new probe all the way back to the Adhars. No additional wiring needed because the Adhars is already wired to the EFIS and working. When the EFIS senses the AOA it will display the AOA bracket in the upper left.

- Install a flap position sensor and wire into the EFIS to display flap position and allow AOA calibration points with the normal flaps down landing position and flaps up.

- AFS is working on a tone generator similar to Vac?s that will allow selection of this or the current ?Angle-Angle-Push? audio tone.

- Complete the recommended AFS AOA calibration procedure

I think that covers the installation I?ve discussed with Rob at AFS. I could install Vac?s system but the AFS solution seems easier to implement without having to build the AOA computer box and I would still need the AOA probe anyway.

So if anyone has the new Dynon Pitot/AOA probe or the Ray Allen POS-12 flap position sensor not being used let me know. I am debating whether to start purchasing components or just leave everything as is. I would like to have AOA but don?t relish the cost or extra work & down time to do it.

Have you attacked these installations yet? I'm going to install the Dynon heated AOA pitot this weekend and have to fish the extra 1/4" tube through the wing too. Also going to install the flap position sensor. Looking for suggestions from anyone who's done it recently.

[Vac]

Carlos,

There is actually a Van's drawing for the Ray Allen flap position sensor in the RV-8. I used the same sensor in the -4 (which might be the only airplane with Armstrong flaps and a flap position sensor!). I used an adel clamp and digital welding rod :





Oly,

The AFS tone will be similar, but will be based on a .wav file which is not the same technology that we are using in the ONSPEED experiment. Our system works like the USAF systems: it actually computes AOA using pressure and IMU inputs, and then generates a tone based on actual AOA and rate of change. We've designed it for high G onset rates (which equates to good damping in turbulent conditions as well as good performance during BFM) and recently cracked the nut on high-alpha performance post-stall (which can be used to generate a recovery display). We are also incorporating OWS (overload warning logic) and airspeed warning as well so we can essentially "paint" the entire envelope using aural logic (while accommodating symmetric and asymmetric G loading). I'm not sure how well a .wav "look up table" AOA logic will work in a maneuvering environment. It may work great, but we won't know until it's tested. AFS has boatloads of experience with AOA, so we are looking forward to seeing what they come up with!

v/r,

Vac

[Pilot135pd]

Originally Posted by Vac

Carlos,

There is actually a Van's drawing for the Ray Allen flap position sensor in the RV-8. I used the same sensor in the -4 (which might be the only airplane with Armstrong flaps and a flap position sensor!):

Oly,

The AFS tone will be similar, but will be based on a .wav file which is not the same technology that we are using in the ONSPEED experiment. Our system works like the USAF systems: it actually computes AOA using pressure and IMU inputs, and then generates a tone based on actual AOA and rate of change. We've designed it for high G onset rates (which equates to good damping in turbulent conditions as well as during BFM) and recently cracked the nut on high-alpha performance post-stall (which can be used to generate a recovery display). We are also incorporating OWS (overload warning logic) and airspeed warning as well so we can essentially "paint" the entire envelope using aural logic and accommodate symmetric and asymmetric G loading. I'm not sure how well a .wav "look up table" AOA logic will work in a maneuvering environment. It may work great, but we won't know until it's tested. AFS has boatloads of experience with AOA, so we are looking forward to seeing what they come up with!

v/r,

Vac

Plus the yaw angle where the pitot info ends and the internal gyros take over, that's impressive GOT magic dragon stuff there !

Thanks Vac, those pictures are exactly what I needed to get an idea. I'll also go search for the Van's drawings.

[pvalovich]

-8A. I'm a biased former Navy carrier guy so I installed an AFS AOA system on my initial 3500, upgraded to 4500. No issues with the operation. However, one big issue with my thought/decision process.

I elected to have the display only on the AFS EFIS screen. Should have installed an AOA indicator on the glareshield to be visible throughout the landing/maneuvering envelope - just like the Navy proved eons ago. Have to refocus from the runway/outside to inside the cockpit to see the display. Not difficult or dangerous - just somewhat disruptive.

[Pilot135pd]

For those who have installed the Flap Position Sensor already, did you verify if you get the full 5 ohm difference during operation or even if it needs it? After 3 days breaking my back installing it I finally have it to where I get a full extension of the sensor with flaps extended but when they're fully retracted I still have a little play left.

I'm getting the following readings on the green and blue wires :

Fully extended flaps 4.97 ohms
20 degree flaps 2.7ohms
Fully retracted flaps 1.25 ohms

Since I don't know how this is measured in the system or when calibrating, would these values seem correct?

Originally Posted by Vac

Carlos,
There is actually a Van's drawing for the Ray Allen flap position sensor in the RV-8. I used the same sensor in the -4 (which might be the only airplane with Armstrong flaps and a flap position sensor!). I used an adel clamp and digital welding rod :
Vac

Never found the drawings on the Van's plans but your pictures were helpful. Based on the above resistance values, will it work with the ON SPEED box?

[Lenny Iszak]

Carlos,

You don't need to have full travel of the flap position sensor (potentiometer). It's actually better to leave a little play on both ends.

The values you mentioned will work with the OnSpeed Gen 2 box. You can calibrate each flap position to any potentiometer value, and use up to 5 positions.

Lenny

Originally Posted by Pilot135pd

Based on the above resistance values, will it work with the ON SPEED box?

[Pilot135pd]

Originally Posted by Lenny Iszak

Carlos,

You don't need to have full travel of the flap position sensor (potentiometer). It's actually better leave a little play on both ends.

The values you mentioned will work with the OnSpeed Gen 2 box. You can calibrate each flap position to any potentiometer value, and use up to 5 positions.

Lenny

Perfect. Thanks Lenny !

[buchaneer]

Hi,
Sent a lot of what I considered relevant and technical queries which included many of these items to Dynon/AFS.
Haven't heard a dickie bird since so they obviously aren't actively promoting the Sport or Pro very disappointing.
I am an amateur in this field so I asked probably what are silly questions to an expert, but still expected a reply in a reasonable timescale.
It has also cost me money as I was waiting for a reply prior to buying one on forum and opportunity lost.