Has Oshkosh gotten to big?

[Flying Canuck]

Originally Posted by cderk

The airport shut down because of the C-5 fire.

I was watching the EAA live feed last night and listening to both tower frequencies. The C-5 fire happened quite a while after it landed. Before they indicated they had a fire, they spent a fair amount of time on a taxiway (P2) perpendicular to and just off of 18R/36L with engines running above idle. Tower was keeping traffic out from behind them, but they were still landing traffic on the south end of 18R (base to pink dot, land at yellow). The C-5 pulled ahead and then indicated the brake fire a few minutes later. This was not long before the scheduled airport closure at 2000 and traffic was already low. I didn't hear anything on tower about closing the airport because of the fire, the closure was right at 2000 and was the planned nightly closure. I watched a couple of F18s come in on 36L at about 1950 and I don't think the fire had been indicated yet. What I found interesting was that they were landing traffic on both 18R and 36L with only a few minutes in between. Tower was very much on top of everything going on.

I would have liked to have been there in person, but I've had to settle for camping on the live video feeds.

[Dugaru]

...it was not much fun being in the slosh.

We got there Friday afternoon and then got the three thunderstorms right in the face. Something like 5 inches of rain over the two days (and the ground was already wet and rutted).

EVERYTHING got SOAKING wet. A number of people were hunting for tent parts Saturday morning. I think we got really lucky not to have more tent/people/aircraft damage, especially Friday night; the storm seemed to weaken a bit right before it hit us.

We left Tuesday afternoon and the grass where we were was just barely taxi-able, thanks to the heroic efforts of a grader that morning. I don't think there was any way we could have gotten out Monday afternoon or maybe even Tuesday morning in my -9A. A Cessna with big tires got out Monday evening and it looked like he was "drifting" in the mud.

With all that said, the whole thing was glorious, and the weather Monday and Tuesday was perfect. I love being at Oshkosh.

Originally Posted by rightrudder

I thoroughly, completely enjoyed Osh, but in both '18 and this year I was caught up in lengthy weather delays getting in. So frustrating to have perfect VFR conditions but no parking available due to slosh factor!

[JimP]

Originally Posted by scard

On our outbound Thursday morning, we listened as they re-wrote the notam on the fly and tried to get everyone to start the "procedure" NOT at rippon but at the south west corner of Green lake, and a mile in trail. It looked like some people were able to comprehend that, but many were not.

This was the same as of Sunday afternoon after they opened. Coming up from Portage this was the basic route anyway, but there were still a significant number of pilots that failed to comprehend the instruction, but to be fair, I'm not sure if they're monitoring FISK approach until RIPON, which seems way too late. I also suspect these are the same pilots that follow the road from RIPON and not the freakin' railroad tracks!!!

[MikeyDale]

We had a great time and it was worth the effort and expense!

[1001001]

Perhaps if it is an issue, AirVenture could be split into multiple events. I have not yet attended the event, so I'm not speaking from any experience with AirVenture itself, but...

There is a prominent shooting event that grew so big that it is hosted twice a year. At a small range in Kentucky, the Knob Creek Machinegun Shoot and show draws tens of thousands of shooters and spectators over the course of a weekend (Anecdotally, the word was back in the 2007 - 2010 time frame or so that attendance reached 90,000 visitors during one of the semiannual meets). While it is a much smaller undertaking than AirVenture, the venue used to get overfilled and the facilities, including show space and match slots were taxed to the limit.

Hosting the event twice a year allows more people to attend, especially those who can't make a single particular date, and it hedges against bad weather on one date. Doing the same with Airventure would probably not double the preparation effort, but would increase it somewhat. The benefits might be more attendance overall, better visitor experience, more opportunity for people with restrictive schedules to attend, and possibly more vendor coverage.

[ClayR_9A]

Instead of Green Lake to Ripon to Fisk, they should just change the whole procedure to ALWAYS circle green lake and have ATC below at the shoreline clearing planes to start the procedure to either Ripon or Fisk directly.

While I was circling, ATC kept saying "Remain holding over Green Lake" but planes just kept flying direct to Ripon and/or leaving Green lake and starting the procedure anyway. I finally just did the same thing, because if you did, and weren't bunched up, they'd clear you on to land. This was Sun evening.

Also, my interpretation of "follow the shoreline" means "Fly above the shoreline." Planes were often a mile or two outside the shoreline which made things dicey too.

Overall though, having ADS-B traffic on my panel made the whole experience 1000% better than trying to find traffic by sight alone. Would love to see ATC use that data exclusively to "clear" people out of holding by N number (even keeping track of how many times people have circled). Those flying anonymously should use a different procedure and lower priority to get in.

[rockwoodrv9]

I hate being in the pattern with even one more plane, I can't imaging flying into AV. Listening and trying to watch on live feeds, looks like there were other pilots who probably shouldn't have been in the pattern either!

I was disappointed that EAA did not set up a FIXED camera for the arrivals and departures. It is fun watching all the chaos and then the camera would pan to the metal tower and to parts of the show too far away to care what they were showing. I can't believe it would be that difficult or expensive.

[JimWoo50]

I heard approach controller sending everybody to sw corner of Green Lake Thur. am about 10:30 so I went out there and never saw another plane until Ripon. Made 27 app, turned left after landing and soon was holding on to whatever I could because the ground was rough.

On departure I started engine at 6:45 and was wheels up off 18 at 6:59 and that was after taxiing from HBP. Very nice. Got home just before sunset.

Found out from acquaintances that some pilots prefer parking at FDL because more flexibility as to when they fly. Only drawback is the bus fee is $20. From what I am told. But they drop off right at the front gate.

Was a GREAT show had a great time and managed to get my ads-b solution questions answered.

[Steve Melton]

Oshkosh seemed bigger this year but we liked it. Wednesday approach at noon, planes circling Green Lake, ATIS reported GA parking and camping closed, Vintage parking closed, homebuilts come on in. The wifey wasn't sure about camping but quickly warmed to it. A great time.

first day pitching the tent. she wasn't sure about this camping stuff.



***

last day, she enjoyed it. the big tent helped. 35 lb, no trouble. flush toilets were a major item for her and she land marked them.

[bkc3921]

Well, yes and no...Probably stating the obvious, but OSH is no longer one event, but several. You have the home builders/general aviation crowd, the corporate crowd, the military/warbird guys, and everything else (Ford, John Deere, Flymarket, and other non-aviation vendors)......

As much as I would love smaller events that cater only to my interests (ha!), I don't think that one part of the body can exist without the others. Having been 31 out of 35 years, my routine is set anyway. It is only through the sheer number of people that OSH can attract the "total package" of ALL things aviation.....

Sooner or later, OSH will reach saturation, the market will do its job, and it will level off. But for now, I am pleased to be able to go one place and get the total experience...things I've done, and things yet to be experienced.

I am humbled to be part of a community that contains so many bright, innovative, and genuinely great people....and it's nice to see them all in one place...in Wisconsin... in July....at Oshkosh.... the greatest show on the planet..!!