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  #11  
Old 05-31-2019, 08:13 AM
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Dugaru Dugaru is offline
 
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Default Further comments on good advice

Quote:
Originally Posted by Canadian_JOY View Post
If I were in this position I would likely negotiate an ownership stake in the aircraft that was paid for in avionics.
Agreed, for this kind of investment it would make sense for you to get a share of the plane. I think the overall plan is a good one; even though a 7A might not be the perfect basic IFR trainer I think it is entirely doable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Canadian_JOY View Post
The D100 is a good box but gives no redundancy of indications. Think of installing a second display like a D10A.
Agree STRONGLY. And be sure to spring for the backup battery. A backup battery powered mini-EFIS provides a huge, huge, amount of real-world IFR redundancy, and in the experimental world it is absolutely off the charts in terms of cost-effectiveness. I once used one (a G5 in my case) to turn a PVSPCBMOI (Potentially Very Serious Problem Caused By My Own Ignorance) into a not-very-serious problem.

Did I mention that you should be sure to get the backup battery?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Canadian_JOY View Post
I would also bite the bullet and install an Avidyne IFD440 GPS/Nav/Com right out of the gate. Yes, it's big money.
As a practical matter, I think a certified GPS IFR navigator is the bare minimum for a usable IFR training and traveling platform. With that said, you could install something like an 89B, and that would get the job done. On the other hand, the older certified navigators are getting OLD, and LPV approaches are nice. I know nothing about the Avidyne, but can add that a used 430W could also make sense here, budget permitting.
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  #12  
Old 05-31-2019, 09:19 AM
blaplante blaplante is offline
 
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Default VOR/ILS and some redundancy

Check out the VAL INS 429 - you get some redundancy as it has built in display - the D100 can die and you still have an indicator.

If you can fit the panel space a Garmin 400W is a GPS only box, much cheaper than the more common 430W - and this can drive the D100. Note however that without the Dynon hs34 the GPS to dynon interface is limited. It won't turn anticipate (ok, nice but not a big deal), and, most important the CDI sensitivity on the Dynon won't change as you go from enroute to approach. Which is a deal breaker. I've got the 400W and a D10A and have personal experience on that problem.

But --- assuming you could fit it all, a 400W, INS429, and HS34 will make a nice suite with redundancy and capable of flying VOR, ILS, and GPS approaches.

Bryan
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  #13  
Old 05-31-2019, 01:58 PM
BobTurner BobTurner is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mattwood View Post
- I don't anticipate flying IFR very often if ever, but it would be nice to have the ability if really needed. .
IF you don't fly IFR very often (or equivalent hood practice) then you will not have the ability if really needed. Instrument skills are very perishable.

PS for Ed: +1. But you left out NDB approaches - the true test of internal position awareness!
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  #14  
Old 05-31-2019, 03:50 PM
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Ed_Wischmeyer Ed_Wischmeyer is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobTurner View Post
PS for Ed: +1. But you left out NDB approaches - the true test of internal position awareness!
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  #15  
Old 05-31-2019, 08:04 PM
Kellym Kellym is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dugaru View Post
A

As a practical matter, I think a certified GPS IFR navigator is the bare minimum for a usable IFR training and traveling platform. With that said, you could install something like an 89B, and that would get the job done. On the other hand, the older certified navigators are getting OLD, and LPV approaches are nice. I know nothing about the Avidyne, but can add that a used 430W could also make sense here, budget permitting.
Disagree strongly. No GPS is needed to get the rating. Only VOR and ILS.
Equipping to actually fly IFR is very different from having equipment required to get the rating. Not having an approach certified GPS narrows the types of approaches you have to demonstrate on the checkride. Learning an IFR GPS is incrementally more difficult than learning VOR and ILS.
The learning of precision attitude flying is very valuable and is not that perishable.
Retaining specifics of flying approaches is much more perishable.
All of the first generation IFR GPSs are functionally obsolete. A few may have nav data updates still available and may still work, but are not repairable and have no factory support. That includes the first generation 430s.
Purchasing any of those units is a total waste of money.
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  #16  
Old 06-01-2019, 12:47 PM
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Dugaru Dugaru is offline
 
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Default We don?t actually disagree of course....

?As a practical matter, I think a certified GPS IFR navigator is the bare minimum for a usable IFR training and traveling platform.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kellym View Post
Disagree strongly. No GPS is needed to get the rating. Only VOR and ILS.
Equipping to actually fly IFR is very different from having equipment required to get the rating. Not having an approach certified GPS narrows the types of approaches you have to demonstrate on the checkride. Learning an IFR GPS is incrementally more difficult than learning VOR and ILS.
The learning of precision attitude flying is very valuable and is not that perishable.
Retaining specifics of flying approaches is much more perishable.
All of the first generation IFR GPSs are functionally obsolete. A few may have nav data updates still available and may still work, but are not repairable and have no factory support. That includes the first generation 430s.
Purchasing any of those units is a total waste of money.
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  #17  
Old 06-01-2019, 01:38 PM
flyinga flyinga is offline
 
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What Kelly said about required nav equipment is correct, however a gps with moving map makes all approaches much easier.
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  #18  
Old 06-01-2019, 07:15 PM
Dreamin9 Dreamin9 is offline
 
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I have a Dynon Touch and at the press of a couple keys I can switch between traditional six pack or modern glass display. Adaption to modern glass after many years of ?steam gauges? was not intuitive but in the end a positive move. As a bonus I have an hour of battery backup with the Dynon in case the alternators fails. As a further bonus I got rid of that failure prone vacuum system. I?ve had two vac failures in the past and the one I had in IMC was not fun.

ILS? My certified navigator is a Garmin GTN 625. It flies RNAV approaches only. I figure I?ll never have a need to fly an ILS again. In the Northeast at least, every airport with an ILS also has an RNAV approach. On the other hand, I?m aware of MANY airports, some that never had an instrument approach before, that now have RNAV approaches. Somebody going to say an ILS will have lower minimums. That?s actually changing. At my nearby Class C airport (KBUF), RNAVs on runways 5, 23, 32 all have 200? DH?s. My modest 3200? home drome is soon to get an RNAV approach with a 300? DH!

I did kinda enjoy NDB approaches though.

Carl
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  #19  
Old 06-01-2019, 07:29 PM
BobTurner BobTurner is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreamin9 View Post
ILS? My certified navigator is a Garmin GTN 625. It flies RNAV approaches only. I figure I?ll never have a need to fly an ILS again.

I did kinda enjoy NDB approaches though.

Carl
Unfortunately the OP asked about training. The current test standards require more than just GPS approaches. Now, he could add an NDB...
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  #20  
Old 06-02-2019, 10:49 AM
rongawer rongawer is offline
 
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Default NDB?

Bob, I thought NDB/ADF stuff was no longer in the testing standards. I was under the impression NDB?s had gone the way of PAR?s (another really cool approach).
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