Ditching an RV

[F1R]

Originally Posted by RV8JD

As you saw in the video, they were surprised it worked too, after the spring-loaded punch sold for auto glass didn't do anything to the plexiglass.

Even if one doesn't fly over water, it's a good thing to have mounted in the cockpit within easy reach, just in case.

Here is a link if anyone is looking for it:

https://www.amazon.com/Lifehammer-Or...JX6FJ1KCMDWZSB

Now I want to see a video upside down under water when the pilot is deciding if:

A) do I break the plexi before the cockpit fills with water.
B) do I wait until the plexi has water on both sides and I am holding a spare air regulator with one hand and trying in slow motion with the water restricted swings to crack and smash my way out?

C) Should I have jumped out before I hit the water

[gmcjetpilot]

The canopy breaker may be more difficult in a frame not easier. As stated, if cockpit is full of water swinging hammer might be difficult. A powered tool like a very large center punch, with lots of mass, pneumatic (CO2 cartridge) or battery power, could be with designed, like hand held jackhammer. I have heard people recommend right angle pliers or vice grips to grab edge of broken plexiglas to enlarge opening after hole is started. This applies to flipping on land as well.

Flip or not? Taildragger or Trike? It sounds like if you make water contact at min speed, at stall, you may stay up right.

Parachute, have one and I use it for aerobatics. I suppose for overwater that might be an option. The military guys have ejection sest, training, flotation, beacon, dye marker, people flight following....

If you want to fly to the San Juan Islands near Seattle, or Catalina Island, or around the Caribbean you're going to have to fly over the water. It's just a risk you either take.

[falcon900guy]

i realize this is a serious potential, but how often does this happen flipping over? is there any course out there that focuses on this situation?

[F1R]

Most retractable landing gear AC can be landed at a very slight nose high attitude and normally stay upright. Some Bellanca Vikings have been reported to float for over 10 hours in the ocean as they have a cloth covered air tight wing when the drain /vent holes are on the bottom side get sealed by water. As copied from Plane and pilot: "One pilot flying a Bellanca Viking into Narsarsuaq, Greenland, ran out of fuel a mere seven miles from the airport. Sadly, he was forced to put the airplane into the fjord almost in sight of the runway. He left the wheels up and made a remarkably smooth landing, then noticed that his wood-wing airplane with empty tanks had no inclination to sink. The tanks were acting like pontoons. After the pilot was picked up by a fishing boat, the crew threw a line around the prop and, very slowly, towed the Bellanca to the airport. The pilot jumped back in, manually extended the wheels, then had a four-wheel-drive truck pull the airplane out of the water, hauled it up on the beach, repaired it and put it back into service."

Perhaps floatation wing tips on an RV's would be a neat builder option for those crossing the big water.
You certainly would not want them deploying in flight by accident.

I have no numbers regarding fixed gear AC but a high percentage flip inverted.
There have been a few reported cases of fixed gear ac and even RV's staying upright.
If there was a method to jettison the main and nose gear it would be a lot easier to stay upright.

Training.
There are dunker tank/underwater egress training courses available. A lot of oil companies with off shore drilling crews provide this as part of the job training.https://youtu.be/RSyHWuVHuzk?t=20

Then try some kayak rolling lessons starting in swimming pools with a face mask. The progress to cold water outside that is only 2 or 3 degrees above freezing. Think Ice Cream headache even if you can roll yourself quickly upright. You will do lots of wet exits before you master the roil.

RVs are fast and flying is fun. I don't mind skirting around lakes and or maintaining safe gliding distance to reach the shore.

https://www.planeandpilotmag.com/art.../#.XMZ1jC8ZPRY

[Lote]

The story about the floating Bellanca makes me wonder. I wonder if an RV would float if one were to pro seal the wings like we do the fuel tanks. And maybe add some pro sealed compartments in the fuselage.

[Lote]

And leave a small hole for pressure equalization.

[F1R]

Here is a demonstrated technique for staying upright. Likely somewhere between difficult to impossible to repeat. At least it would be very expensive to try. It appears you need to wipe the mains off first with a good hard smack at enough airspeed to maintain flight control.

https://youtu.be/5FipWllaCl8?t=170

YMMV

[woxofswa]

Just arm chair theorizing, but it seems to this public schooled brain that for an RV or similar FG aircraft, whether it flips or not, it?s going to transition to the same position. Assuming structurally intact and deep enough water, I would envision the airplane having its buoyancy in the wings and floor of the fuselage so the engine should sink down bringing the tail up out of the water, probably tipped 45 degrees or so, semi inverted, with the top of the rudder pointing back toward the water. I?m guessing that it would hold that aquatic attitude for at least several minutes until the semi sealed parts of the wing eventually fill and the carcas sinks nose first. If my theory is correct, in the case of the 10, the rear windows could be above water and if installed correctly, should be able to be kicked out relatively easy and serve as the best egress point, leaving the main doors closed to forestall losing whatever (temporary) displacement the forward fuselage provides.

[Low Pass]

Originally Posted by F1R

Here is a demonstrated technique for staying upright. Likely somewhere between difficult to impossible to repeat. At least it would be very expensive to try. It appears you need to wipe the mains off first with a good hard smack at enough airspeed to maintain flight control.

https://youtu.be/5FipWllaCl8?t=170

YMMV

Very interesting and thanks for sharing. The big variable to me is the landing gear flipping the plane. This acro plane managed to shed its gear with the first impact, and the subsequent ditching was relatively uneventful. But the behavior of the tip low ditching idea is still fairly evident with this case, even without the landing gear.

[AirHound]

It’s for fun!
Even in flat IL the place floods and becomes a lake. It all looks familiar until you are upside down and behind the tree line in soup, alone! Probably just enough water/muck to prevent any kind of flipped egress.

My no doubt, flawed thought is; Stick to roads, dodge wires, poles, and hope to pay for the mail boxes and clothes lines, chicken coops, but just be seen is key. Drop in near someone. IMHO

...but then again, there’s the ruptured fuel system to think about!