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  #41  
Old 02-06-2017, 06:33 PM
Bevan Bevan is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: BC
Posts: 1,674
Default

When that data sheet says max discharge rate is 40amps, and it also says "short circuit protection", one could conclude that when used as a starter battery, the protection system should think of this event as a short circuit and shut it down, but apparently it doesn't. Hmmm

Bevan
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O-360-A1F6 (parallel valve) 180HP
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  #42  
Old 02-07-2017, 02:33 AM
Pittsartist Pittsartist is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: UK
Posts: 160
Default LiFePo and Pmags

I'd not seen this thread until today - just been having a read through and comparing with my own experiences.

I Fitted a LiFePo battery to my Pitts in 2013. (The Pitts is IO 0-360 / Injected with 2 Pmags.)

4 Years later I have had Zero issues - other than the reason for this post.

Right from the outset, I had some starting difficulties in cold weather. After much head scratching and battery changing it turned out that I was getting a voltage drop when cranking that made the P mags see less than 9 volts. If this happens they re boot and wont spark until they have seen a full rotation. With the LiFePo4 battery the engine would still crank at acceptable speed, but the voltage dropped over the compressions.

Once the problem was identified I have used a work around solution of a small dedicated battery to the Pmags. 4 years later and all still works well.

I remain a fan of the battery technology - It's the cheapest way of reducing aircraft weight out there (other than going on a diet perhaps). Just thought I'd mention the voltage drop experience in case anyone else has a similar issues.
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  #43  
Old 02-07-2017, 11:50 AM
rongawer rongawer is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Brentwood, CA
Posts: 659
Default 120A no problem

I've done test discharges to verify cold cranking amps of this battery with battery tester. Simulating an engine start (which is 100A on my little engines 1200W starter), I did 120A for 15 seconds no problem. I allowed the battery to rest for 30 seconds and it did it again, three times. Voltage was still >14.4VDC without charging.

I love a good experiment.

I'll continue to evaluate it and report back.
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- RV10, Build in progress.
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Last edited by rongawer : 02-07-2017 at 11:53 AM.
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  #44  
Old 02-07-2017, 12:02 PM
rongawer rongawer is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Brentwood, CA
Posts: 659
Default

Another vendor is this one:
Next Gen Battery

I spoke with these folks as well and they say 100A is rated peak discharge for 30 seconds, which is the definition of cold cranking amps.
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Ron Gawer

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- RV12, N975G, "The Commuter"...many great hours and happy landings so far.
- Several others that are now just great memories for me.
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  #45  
Old 02-07-2017, 12:27 PM
Aggie78 Aggie78 is offline
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aggie78 View Post
I'm talking about the one Ron is using...By The Lithium Battery company.

And, I'm just relaying what the folks answering the phone told me.....
I just got a phone call back from Ron at "The Lithium Battery Company" on the use discussed in this thread for their LBC-20 battery.

Not designed for this type of service, and it is not a suggested or authorized use, just like the conversation with them yesterday.

There will be no support or warranty given...With any kind of problem, you will be completely on your own...

Still looking for one that will fit in the Van's battery box that holds the PC-680 but not the EarthX.
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  #46  
Old 02-07-2017, 12:41 PM
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ChiefPilot ChiefPilot is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Twin Cities, MN
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rv7charlie View Post
But using anything outside its design parameters is...an experiment. The poop sheet on that battery explicitly states that maximum draw should be less than 40 amps, and max continuous should be less than 20 amps.
If you're talking about the Shorai battery, it's CCA is 270amps - well over the max pull from the starter at about 200amps. Continuous approaches zero while the alternator is operating, and my electrical analysis spreadsheet shows a 12amp draw in the event of alternator failure.

>500 hours of operating in MN summers (>90?F), winter (<0?F), VFR/IFR, Day/Night, acro (incl. IAC and mock aerial combat) and zero failures. A complete discharge due to leaving the master on. It's still going strong...
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  #47  
Old 02-07-2017, 12:56 PM
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DanH DanH is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: 08A
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aggie78 View Post
I just got a phone call back from Ron at "The Lithium Battery Company" on the use discussed in this thread for their LBC-20 battery.
Not designed for this type of service, and it is not a suggested or authorized use, just like the conversation with them yesterday.
Did Ron explain why?

Common sense says they're not giving up the whole cranking battery market without good reason.
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  #48  
Old 02-07-2017, 01:23 PM
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airguy airguy is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Garden City, Tx
Posts: 5,145
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bevan View Post
When that data sheet says max discharge rate is 40amps, and it also says "short circuit protection", one could conclude that when used as a starter battery, the protection system should think of this event as a short circuit and shut it down, but apparently it doesn't. Hmmm

Bevan
Unless they mean 40 amps per cell, with 4 cells in parallel which would give 160 amps - but it's certainly not stated that way.
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Greg Niehues - SEL, IFR, Repairman Cert.
Garden City, TX VAF 2020 dues paid
N16GN flying 700 hrs and counting; IO360, SDS, WWRV200, Dynon HDX, 430W
Built an off-plan RV9A with too much fuel and too much HP. Should drop dead any minute now.
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  #49  
Old 02-07-2017, 02:46 PM
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PerfTech PerfTech is offline
 
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Location: Redlands, Ca.
Posts: 1,458
Default Love these batteries!!!

...Over 6.5 years, and 1000 plus hrs. with lots of abuse. No issues to date.
I am very happy with the Shorai battery and saved 23 lb over the 925 I removed. Thanks, Allan
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  #50  
Old 02-07-2017, 03:06 PM
rongawer rongawer is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Brentwood, CA
Posts: 659
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The Shorai batteries look like very good options, and cost effective. I like it.
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Ron Gawer

- RV10, Build in progress.
- RV12, N975G, "The Commuter"...many great hours and happy landings so far.
- Several others that are now just great memories for me.
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