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01-18-2017, 08:29 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: SC
Posts: 12,887
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RFSchaller
Kyle,
I'm not sure about the legality of a handheld VOR receiver for IFR. I have an SP-400 and have flown both VOR and ILS approaches in VFR to evaluate it. The ILS was dead on but the VOR was not reliable beyond about 15 miles from the station. My conclusion is that it's a great backup if you can get to the IAF, but not reliable enough to depend on for enroute. Others may have had a different experience with it.
Rich
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Using a handheld VOR receiver for IFR is legal, believe it or not. It is "Certified" when you certify it in you log your VOR check.
Now, if you want to fly IFR with it is another thing altogether.
__________________
Bill R.
RV-9 (Yes, it's a dragon tail)
O-360 w/ dual P-mags
Build the plane you want, not the plane others want you to build!
SC86 - Easley, SC
www.repucci.com/bill/baf.html
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01-20-2017, 12:18 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 461
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RFSchaller
Torsten and I exchanged copies of our operating limits. I found it interesting that his new limits address the life limited components and the requirements of the aircraft operating handbook.
There seems to be some regulatory creep in this moving things closer to the SLSA requirements.
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I've noticed that. Fortunately, we Experimentals can write, change and amend our own POH, so I'm not worried yet.
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01-22-2017, 09:08 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Oconomowoc, WI
Posts: 71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mel
If he is "picking and choosing", he is in violation of the FARs. The required paragraphs for each category are clearly spelled out in the order.
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Mel,
Where can I find the order. My RV12 ELSA inspection was done by the FAA. My operation limitations restrict me to VFR and does not allow a path to upgrade the plane to IFR in phase 2. I would like to get mine corrected but would like to be able to reference something official for discussion.
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01-22-2017, 09:34 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Dallas area
Posts: 10,769
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rrhsch
Mel,
Where can I find the order. My RV12 ELSA inspection was done by the FAA. My operation limitations restrict me to VFR and does not allow a path to upgrade the plane to IFR in phase 2. I would like to get mine corrected but would like to be able to reference something official for discussion.
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Operating limitations are in FAA Order 8130.2H, Appendix C.
It takes quite a bit of patience to get through them if you are not familiar.
The paragraph you are looking for is #41. It applies to 21.191(b), (f), (g), (h), & (i). and states:
"Instrument flight operations are authorized if the instruments specified in
§ 91.205(d) are installed, operational, and maintained in accordance with
the applicable requirements of part 91. All maintenance or inspection of
this equipment must be recorded in the aircraft maintenance records and
include the following items: date, work performed, and name and
certificate number of person returning aircraft to service. (41)"
__________________
Mel Asberry, DAR since the last century.
EAA Flight Advisor/Tech Counselor, Friend of the RV-1
Recipient of Tony Bingelis Award and Wright Brothers Master Pilot Award
USAF Vet, High School E-LSA Project Mentor.
RV-6 Flying since 1993 (sold)
<rvmel(at)icloud.com>
Last edited by Mel : 01-23-2017 at 06:25 AM.
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01-22-2017, 10:24 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Livermore, CA
Posts: 6,797
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Quote:
Originally Posted by N941WR
Using a handheld VOR receiver for IFR is legal, believe it or not. It is "Certified" when you certify it in you log your VOR check.
Now, if you want to fly IFR with it is another thing altogether.
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Looking at Mel's quote of the op limits (above), I believe a handheld is not legal for meeting the requirements, unless it is "installed".
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01-23-2017, 05:57 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Oconomowoc, WI
Posts: 71
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Mel
My ELSA operation limitations doesn't allow the installation of and use of TOS IFR equipment for IFR use. I thought if the RV-12 was built ELSA and was certified as such that the operation limitations would contain standard language allowing for IFR if so equipped per 91.205 (d). during phase 2.
If this is correct, where can I find the authoritative source for the language that must be used in the operating limitations?
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01-23-2017, 06:13 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Coeur d'Alene, ID/Casa Grande, AZ
Posts: 654
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rrhsch
Mel
My ELSA operation limitations doesn't allow the installation of and use of TOS IFR equipment for IFR use. I thought if the RV-12 was built ELSA and was certified as such that the operation limitations would contain standard language allowing for IFR if so equipped per 91.205 (d). during phase 2.
If this is correct, where can I find the authoritative source for the language that must be used in the operating limitations?
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I might be stepping into doo doo, but my understanding is....once air worthiness certificate is give for E-LSA build; you can make alterations "as long as you don't..1. Exceed 1320 gross, 2. Exceed E-LSA speed. Appropriate changes in POH would be needed for equipment added. Along with maintaining fixed or ground adjustable prop.
__________________
Ric Dickison
307 (CAB) Phantom
Search and Destroy (Can Tho RVN)
Distinguished Flying Cross Society Member
CH-47 & UH-1H "Driver"
Rotax 9 Series Service IRMT
RV-12 Kit#729 "N312RD" is now a full functioning fun machine!! Thanks Van for fulfilling my dream😎
2018 Dues Paid
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01-23-2017, 08:36 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Dallas area
Posts: 10,769
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phantom30
I might be stepping into doo doo, but my understanding is....once air worthiness certificate is give for E-LSA build; you can make alterations "as long as you don't..1. Exceed 1320 gross, 2. Exceed E-LSA speed. Appropriate changes in POH would be needed for equipment added. Along with maintaining fixed or ground adjustable prop.
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You cannot make any changes that conflict with the operating limitations.
__________________
Mel Asberry, DAR since the last century.
EAA Flight Advisor/Tech Counselor, Friend of the RV-1
Recipient of Tony Bingelis Award and Wright Brothers Master Pilot Award
USAF Vet, High School E-LSA Project Mentor.
RV-6 Flying since 1993 (sold)
<rvmel(at)icloud.com>
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01-23-2017, 08:36 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Dallas area
Posts: 10,769
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rrhsch
Mel
My ELSA operation limitations doesn't allow the installation of and use of TOS IFR equipment for IFR use. I thought if the RV-12 was built ELSA and was certified as such that the operation limitations would contain standard language allowing for IFR if so equipped per 91.205 (d). during phase 2.
If this is correct, where can I find the authoritative source for the language that must be used in the operating limitations?
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See post 34 above.
__________________
Mel Asberry, DAR since the last century.
EAA Flight Advisor/Tech Counselor, Friend of the RV-1
Recipient of Tony Bingelis Award and Wright Brothers Master Pilot Award
USAF Vet, High School E-LSA Project Mentor.
RV-6 Flying since 1993 (sold)
<rvmel(at)icloud.com>
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02-18-2017, 05:58 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: St Louis, MO
Posts: 323
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FYI and potential action on engine start. Compared revision 6 dated 01/03/17 with older POH and noted page 4-7 has the avionics switch coming on after engine start just like GA aircraft.
Don't know why or when Vans made this change on Engine Start procedure, but it should be noted by operators of RV-12's with older POH's.
Suggest also compare both your's and the new POH Shut down procedure.
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