VansAirForceForums  
Home > VansAirForceForums

- POSTING RULES
- Donate yearly (please).
- Advertise in here!

- Today's Posts | Insert Pics


Go Back   VAF Forums > Avionics / Interiors / Fiberglass > ADS-B
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Today's Posts

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #201  
Old 01-03-2017, 12:36 PM
DaleB's Avatar
DaleB DaleB is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Omaha, NE (KMLE)
Posts: 2,247
Default

I've also seen, on another board, posts by someone (probably the same guy) who says his wife worked in some unspecified capacity for Navworx at some unspecified point in past, and who may or more likely may not have the slightest clue what's going on. So far those posts have not included anything that would indicate either he or his ex-employee wife have any information that the rest of us don't have, which is to say... they're essentially clueless too.

Ain't the Internet grand? I guess we all watch and wait to see what happens next. I hope they work it out.
__________________
Dale

Omaha, NE
RV-12 # 222 N980KM "Screamin' Canary" (bought flying)
Fisher Celebrity (under construction)
Previous RV-7 project (sold)
Reply With Quote
  #202  
Old 01-03-2017, 01:10 PM
dtw_rv6 dtw_rv6 is offline
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Martinsville, IN
Posts: 454
Default

Does anyone see the hypocrisy here?

FAA and Dynon are putting non-TSO D10a in Part 23 aircraft and the world hasn't ended. Navworx puts a non TSO GPS in an EXPERIMENTAL airplane and the FAA acts like we will see 747s crashing into GA aircraft daily.

I certainly can't see any consistency here, but that is probably an unrealistic expectation from me.

Kudos to Dynon for their efforts by the way. Hopefully they don't get steamrolled in a similar way at some point.
Reply With Quote
  #203  
Old 01-03-2017, 01:24 PM
Paul 5r4 Paul 5r4 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Foley, Al
Posts: 563
Default

Hypocrisy.... yep, a perfect synonym for POLITICS!

I wonder how the FAA would respond if the general public were somehow made aware, (and understood), the magnitude of reduction in safety actions like this cause.
__________________
Paul Gray
Foley, Alabama
N729PG..... 450+ hrs
RV 7A, Lycoming 0 320 D1A, Sensenich FP propeller
pilotforfun2001@yahoo.com
VAF supporter $$$

Last edited by Paul 5r4 : 01-03-2017 at 01:27 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #204  
Old 01-03-2017, 01:25 PM
BobTurner BobTurner is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Livermore, CA
Posts: 6,797
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dtw_rv6 View Post
Does anyone see the hypocrisy here?

FAA and Dynon are putting non-TSO D10a in Part 23 aircraft and the world hasn't ended. Navworx puts a non TSO GPS in an EXPERIMENTAL airplane and the FAA acts like we will see 747s crashing into GA aircraft daily.

I certainly can't see any consistency here, but that is probably an unrealistic expectation from me.

Kudos to Dynon for their efforts by the way. Hopefully they don't get steamrolled in a similar way at some point.
Not quite the same.
1. Ultimately, the FAA wants to get rid of radar and use ADSB-out to keep the airliners safe. Airline safety is way more important to the FAA, than having a small plane crash due to loss of attitude info.
2. Perhaps more important, Dynon has worked hand-in-hand with the FAA (and EAA) to make this happen. Not saying this happened with NavWorx, but an open spirt of cooperation seems to work better with the FAA than an advisarial relationship.
Reply With Quote
  #205  
Old 01-03-2017, 04:06 PM
MartySantic's Avatar
MartySantic MartySantic is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Davenport, IA
Posts: 1,390
Default

Anyone have any idea of the accuracy/inaccuracy of the TSO'd GPS chip vs. the non-TSO'd GPS chips. Are we talking a few inches, a few feet, a hundred feet or a mile. My iPhone shows my position sitting in the kitchen within 10 feet as shown on the Google map.

Will the FAA come clean and discuss this issue, which appears to be the main issue in a response?
__________________
Marty Santic ----- W9EAA
RV-12 N128MS ----- Now Flying
My RV-12 Build Log - http://www.martysrv12.blogspot.com/
Davenport, IA
Reply With Quote
  #206  
Old 01-03-2017, 04:25 PM
emuyshondt emuyshondt is offline
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Leander, TX
Posts: 166
Default

The issue is not so much the accuracy when everything is working, but rather the ability to detect that the satellites being used to calculate the position are all working properly and thus the calculated position is accurate. This is the System Integrity Level (SIL) that is causing heartburn for Navworx. There are a lot of technical details involved, beyond just how accurately located a plane is when everything is going right.

I've seen my position jump a few times using my iPad. Usually it is something momentary, or sometimes they are conducting GPS tests. The cheaper receivers don't examine or report any problems with the data being received.
__________________
Henry
Reply With Quote
  #207  
Old 01-04-2017, 10:31 AM
MartySantic's Avatar
MartySantic MartySantic is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Davenport, IA
Posts: 1,390
Default

Has anyone tried to visit Navworx in Rowlett, TX?
__________________
Marty Santic ----- W9EAA
RV-12 N128MS ----- Now Flying
My RV-12 Build Log - http://www.martysrv12.blogspot.com/
Davenport, IA
Reply With Quote
  #208  
Old 01-04-2017, 12:08 PM
lr172 lr172 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Schaumburg, IL
Posts: 5,297
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dtw_rv6 View Post
Does anyone see the hypocrisy here?

FAA and Dynon are putting non-TSO D10a in Part 23 aircraft and the world hasn't ended. Navworx puts a non TSO GPS in an EXPERIMENTAL airplane and the FAA acts like we will see 747s crashing into GA aircraft daily.
Big difference. The FAA is not using the D10A's output to separate traffic. I frankly don't have a problem with the FAA being conservative on this. The output of these units will, some day, be the sole method of aircraft separation. I don't want a midair because some guy decided to use a cheap part. I could care less if he falls out the sky for the same reason. While I don't believe in regulating victimeless crimes, that does not apply to ADS-b equipment.

Larry
__________________
N64LR - RV-6A / IO-320, Flying as of 8/2015
N11LR - RV-10, Flying as of 12/2019
Reply With Quote
  #209  
Old 01-04-2017, 12:13 PM
lr172 lr172 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Schaumburg, IL
Posts: 5,297
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobTurner View Post
2. Perhaps more important, Dynon has worked hand-in-hand with the FAA (and EAA) to make this happen. Not saying this happened with NavWorx, but an open spirt of cooperation seems to work better with the FAA than an advisarial relationship.
From my observations, Bob is right on here. The Navworx fiasco is squarely upon their shoulders, not the FAA's. The Dynon cases are examples that the FAA is being at least moderately cooperative in working with vendors to allow flexibility.

Larry
__________________
N64LR - RV-6A / IO-320, Flying as of 8/2015
N11LR - RV-10, Flying as of 12/2019
Reply With Quote
  #210  
Old 01-04-2017, 12:38 PM
airguy's Avatar
airguy airguy is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Garden City, Tx
Posts: 5,145
Default

Navworx may have had a valid argument, or at least part of a valid argument, but they poked the bear. You don't ever poke the bear. Nothing good comes from poking the bear.
__________________
Greg Niehues - SEL, IFR, Repairman Cert.
Garden City, TX VAF 2020 dues paid
N16GN flying 700 hrs and counting; IO360, SDS, WWRV200, Dynon HDX, 430W
Built an off-plan RV9A with too much fuel and too much HP. Should drop dead any minute now.
Reply With Quote
Reply



Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:16 AM.


The VAFForums come to you courtesy Delta Romeo, LLC. By viewing and participating in them you agree to build your plane using standardized methods and practices and to fly it safely and in accordance with the laws governing the country you are located in.