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  #1  
Old 11-05-2016, 06:42 PM
PilotFuse PilotFuse is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Central MA
Posts: 42
Default OK, RV-14 Builders. Let's hear some updated "cost to build" estimates.

While deciding between the RV-7 and the RV-14, I've been reading a bunch of old threads about total project cost. I know the Van's estimator says you can get something done with a decent VFR panel for $90K, but that doesn't seem realistic based on some of the numbers I've been hearing.

It's almost 2017, and there are a lot of people getting close to finishing their -14s. For those of you who are close to done or finished already, how much are you going to be into your project when all is said and done?

Why am I asking? I placed an order on Friday for an RV-7 empennage based on what I'm considering to be a pretty substantial cost differential between the two models. Today, I received an e-mail from Stoney where he outlined a lot of things he loves about his -14 compared to the -7 he used to own. Now, I'm second guessing myself. Thanks, Stoney! I know this all comes down to mission, but I'm confident the -14 is probably a better fit, so long as it's possible to build one without putting $120K or more in. To repeat what I said to Stoney: "I want the right plane for me, but I also don't want to forego being able to finish while searching for perfection I can't afford."
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  #2  
Old 11-05-2016, 07:17 PM
ronsno ronsno is offline
 
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Location: West Linn, OR
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Good question, I want to know the same thing.
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  #3  
Old 11-05-2016, 07:24 PM
6ato14a 6ato14a is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: longmont, co
Posts: 136
Default Email from Stony

Any chance Stony could make that emai public. Sounds interesting!
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  #4  
Old 11-05-2016, 07:39 PM
PilotFuse PilotFuse is offline
 
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Location: Central MA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6ato14a View Post
Any chance Stony could make that emai public. Sounds interesting!
I wouldn't normally just post a personal message, but I think he'd be comfortable sharing this:

I've owned a 7 that I did not build and now fly my RV-14. Major considerations: what is your mission, cross country trips or shorter trips and aerobatics? 14 is absolutely hands down better cross country and will do aero, just not quite as nimble as the 7. Flies much more stable though. Have you built a plane before? 14 hands down over the 7 is parts and ease of build. Much more advanced kit. With the 7, you have a lot more fabrication and chance for error and will definitely take longer to build. The view out of the 14 is tons better, bigger canopy, lower sides.

I would only consider the 7 if I had a strict budget, were not taller than 5'8" and 170lbs, had built a plane before. Feel free to contact me for further explanation if you like.
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  #5  
Old 11-05-2016, 07:58 PM
YellowJacket RV9 YellowJacket RV9 is offline
 
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Location: Clearwater, FL KCLW
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PilotFuse View Post
I know the Van's estimator says you can get something done with a decent VFR panel for $90K, but that doesn't seem realistic based on some of the numbers I've been hearing.
Sure it is if you are willing to avoid the urge to keep up with the Joneses. My 9A came in under $60k, including a 700 hour O-320 with 0-time cylinders, and a FP Sensenich metal prop, also 700 hours. I have a full, redundant GRT glass panel and modern transponder and radio (GTR-200). I could add an autopilot and IFR nav source for under $5k (and I plan to in the future). I could still be under $90k with a brand new engine.

Can you spend 3 times as much? sure. Do you need to? No.

I would add that it is probably harder to save money on the 14 kit as many decisions like avionics are essentially made for you. It is a more complete kit, but that means less places to be stingy and source your own used equipment, etc.

Chris
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Last edited by YellowJacket RV9 : 11-05-2016 at 08:11 PM.
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  #6  
Old 11-05-2016, 08:18 PM
Kyle Boatright Kyle Boatright is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PilotFuse View Post
While deciding between the RV-7 and the RV-14, I've been reading a bunch of old threads about total project cost. I know the Van's estimator says you can get something done with a decent VFR panel for $90K, but that doesn't seem realistic based on some of the numbers I've been hearing.
At issue is the panel/paint job/interior/FWF war that has been ongoing for a decade or more. People are gravitating towards more expensive options. But you don't have to.

You can install a 180 HP engine and a FP prop. You won't see many people bragging about doing that.

Paint, panel, and interior are similar. There are functional alternatives, and there are higher cost alternatives that are sexier.

It comes down to choices.
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Marietta, GA
2001 RV-6 N46KB
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  #7  
Old 11-05-2016, 08:29 PM
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czechsix czechsix is offline
 
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Location: Spring Hill, KS
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyle Boatright View Post
You can install a 180 HP engine
Not in a -14...you need an angle valve engine for CG reasons, and decent core engines that you can overhaul are harder to find at bargain prices than an O-320 for example that could be used on a -6/7/8/9 if you're on a tight budget.
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  #8  
Old 11-05-2016, 08:39 PM
Kyle Boatright Kyle Boatright is offline
 
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Location: Atlanta, GA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by czechsix View Post
Not in a -14...you need an angle valve engine for CG reasons, and decent core engines that you can overhaul are harder to find at bargain prices than an O-320 for example that could be used on a -6/7/8/9 if you're on a tight budget.
I stand corrected. Why'd I think the 180 was approved?
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  #9  
Old 11-06-2016, 01:39 AM
n982sx n982sx is offline
 
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Location: Chicago, IL
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I just did a quick check on what is included in the 14 estimate. I can say absolutely that you can build it for the $91.5 quoted on the low end.

A few caveats.

The price listed had the list price of the engine but did not list the firewall forward kit. However, with the engine price specials that Van's runs during Sun-n-fun and Airventure, you can get the engine, prop and FF kit for about the list price of the engine and prop.

The price had no tools included. If you have a fully equipped airplane factory at your disposal then you're fine. I built a plane before the 14 so I had a great deal of tools but still needed more. First plane used blind rivets.

The price had a budget of $8,000 for instruments. You can do a lot with that but you can be sucked into a lot more very quickly. Remember, Stein's motto is 'we're not happy until your broke'. Their work is terrific, but if you're on a strict budget you might be buying used equipment and making all the hookups to the included wiring yourself.

If you stick to the estimate you will also be sitting on bare aluminum. Buy foam and make your own.

Lights, trim, etc, etc.

It really comes down to two differences for price. For the 7 you have cheaper engine/prop options and the difference in the basic kit price.

All the extras listed above are extras on the 7 as well. As on both planes, the extras are not needed to fly. They are want to haves not need to haves.

If you're ok with $90 and no extras, build the 14. It can be done.
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  #10  
Old 11-06-2016, 06:15 AM
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Captain_John Captain_John is offline
 
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Location: KPYM
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Mike,

There is a guy starting a 14 project in Falmouth, Mass. I will pick you up and we can go visit him.

Now, I just ran a few numbers and i dare say that his cost of getting the emp, quickbuild wings and fuse along with his IO-390 (no avionics, prop, interior or doo-dads) will be about equal to my completed 7!

...as you know, my 7 has a few bells and whistles too!

I am really looking forward to watching him build this 14! From my understanding, he is going to go all out.

CJ
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