Engine Out on Climb out - a test

[bkilby]

Originally Posted by todehnal

Hey John J (jveatch)! Looks like you took a lot of flack over the posts on your idling engine, and testing returns to your airport. I think your test were very informative. I agree that there are variables, but it was still fantastic info. Thanks for posting it........Tom

I concur. Nice job. You are comfortable with the maneuver and have practiced it. Some people are comfortable with no turns from 1,000ft. Reminds me of talking to another (older) student pilot back when I was training.. he was talking about making no greater bank than 15 degrees when in the pattern.. guess his instructor told him that because he couldn't fly worth a xxxx. Who knows.

[rvbuilder2002]

Hey John J Looks like you took a lot of flack over the posts on your idling engine, and testing returns to your airport. I think your test were very informative. I agree that there are variables, but it was still fantastic info. Thanks for posting it........Tom

I don't see that anyone has given him flack about his tests....
Just pointing out that the information being provided does not show what would happen if the engine actually quit.
In my opinion, that is rather important. For him, and for anyone that might take his info and use it in an actual emergency situation.

[Bevan]

OK, so what is the conclusion here? His test (at idle) indicated 360 feet of altitude was enough to make it back to the runway. Is it acceptable to say he should double that for the real world scenario, say 700 feet?

BTW My flight instructor suggested to me that "straight ahead" means up to +/- 90 degrees so as to not hit anything "straight ahead".

Bevan

[rvbuilder2002]

Originally Posted by Bevan

OK, so what is the conclusion here? His test (at idle) indicated 360 feet of altitude was enough to make it back to the runway. Is it acceptable to say he should double that for the real world scenario, say 700 feet?

BTW My flight instructor suggested to me that "straight ahead" means up to +/- 90 degrees so as to not hit anything "straight ahead".

Bevan

Can't answer the question with the information that has been provided.

As already mentioned, with the course prop pitch that we use on the RV-12, idle speed can have a significant effect (and the OP has never mentioned what his idle speed is set at)

[Paris12Man]

As a test.....

Climb up above your home field (no traffic day) to 3000 AGL and pull the engine to idle and establish best glide speed. Note the rate of descent. Add power and climb back up to 3000 AGL and slow the aircraft to near stall and shut off engine. The prop will begin to windmill at 65kts. Establish same speed as before and note rate of descent. Restart engine and enjoy rest of flight.

Report back to this forum your findings.

[snopercod]

In this situation, an AoA unit is your friend.

[jrs14855]

As I have posted before Sunrise Aviation at John Wayne Airport teaches turn back to pre solo students. VERY hostile environment around this airport and despite the long primary runway many of the GA operations are on the shorter runway. Video of the owner of Sunrise conducting tests in a 172 at a strip inland from John Wayne.

[jrs14855]

Real world experience related by a pilot that had the prop come off a Pitts S2B due to crank flange failure. There was no damage to the cowl or airplane and the glide was so much better without the prop that he almost overshot a 4000' runway. This was NOT a turnback maneuver. The late August Raspet conducted tests with prop removed and cowl sealed, with the airplane towed to altitude behind a 450 Stearman. CAFE foundation also did this. There is a video somewhere of a dead stick aerobatic routine in a Pitts S1S including landing with the prop stopped.
And of course Bob Hoover with the Shrike, both engines shut down at 10' over the runway, loop, roll and dead stick landing with the airplane rolling up to the announcer after landing.
In the famous words of Clint Eastwood, a man's got to know his limitations.

[rv9builder]

Originally Posted by jrs14855

As I have posted before Sunrise Aviation at John Wayne Airport teaches turn back to pre solo students. VERY hostile environment around this airport and despite the long primary runway many of the GA operations are on the shorter runway. Video of the owner of Sunrise conducting tests in a 172 at a strip inland from John Wayne.

Do you have a link?

Thanks,

[Robert Anglin]

This is something that has been taut around the country in some of the training programs. We have been asked to demonstrate it in the past while flying with an instructor. I can't not speak for the 12, but for a 6-7-8 the rule of thumb that has been shown to us is go straight ahead to 400-500' AGL and pull power and come back around in a good nose down attitude as tight as you can be comfortable with. I would not recommend this for everyone or every type of aircraft, but if you practice it up high then work your way back down, it dose work and can be done with an RV. I can tell you that I have modified it a little when I don't like the trees or something around the airport I am leaving and want a little edge in case I were to loose the engine on departure. I get off the ground, turn 30* to the right and climb out. In this way if you have any power or other problem that forces you to make a landing call on the climb out, you have cut down the radius of the turn for a return to the runway if you elect to try and come back around. I like to practice this from time to time with no distractions. Never know if it may be needed some day. Hope this helps as it is just two cents on the subject. Yours, R.E.A. III #80888