O320-E2D…will it fit?

[N941WR]

Originally Posted by rightrudder

Thanks, everyone. This information is hugely helpful! If I go full electric, I will have an enormous annunciator light for the charging system, to go along with the oil pressure light.

Don't bother with the warning light. The lack of engine noise will be warning enough.

If you go all electric, you might as well go with automotive type EFI and Light Speed ignition because houyou will need a complex electrical system to keep you in the air anyway.

Just think of the possibilities.

[krw5927]

Complex electrical system?

Why would a SD-20 backup alternator and a direct battery connection for at least 1 pump not provide redundancy for any single failure? It's not a terribly complex system.

[rightrudder]

I meant full electric for the fuel pumps only. The plan is to build a very simple carbureted day-VFR aircraft with steam gauges. I did splurge for the electric elevator trim and will certainly fit wingtip & tail strobes/landing light(s) for better visibility in the pattern.

[rbibb]

Before you commit to backup electrical system to keep two pumps running at least investigate the costs of the mechanical option. Adding one to an -E2D is dirt simple if the accessory case is set up to do so. If it isn't you can probably get a decent trade in for one that is from any large engine shop who probably has some lying around collecting dust.

Once you had all the parts in place you could do the swap in under an hour.

[N941WR]

Originally Posted by krw5927

Complex electrical system?

Why would a SD-20 backup alternator and a direct battery connection for at least 1 pump not provide redundancy for any single failure? It's not a terribly complex system.

An extra alternator, wiring, and battery(?) does add weight and complexity. Simple as that.

Originally Posted by rightrudder

I meant full electric for the fuel pumps only. The plan is to build a very simple carbureted day-VFR aircraft with steam gauges. I did splurge for the electric elevator trim and will certainly fit wingtip & tail strobes/landing light(s) for better visibility in the pattern.

I hear you but since you are going to have to add a backup alternator and systems to feed your electric pump, you might as well look at all the other options.

Here is something to keep in mind...
Some day you might want to sell your airplane. Having a non-standard aircraft system, especially something as critical as your fuel system, might make your RV very difficult to sell.

My mentor built his -6A with an “H” engine and rather than having a bump on the front of his cowl to accommodate this oddball engine, he put a fuel pump in each wing root. To switch tanks he simply turned one pump on and the other off. He had a backup battery to feed his pumps, just in case.

On takeoff he would turn on both pumps, just in case one fails. That is not really any different than the rest of us.

However, after he passed on (natural causes), the new owner of his plane installed the engine driven pump and moved to a more “standard” fuel system before he would fly it. The family sold his beautiful -6A for much less than market value because of the fuel system. The buyer was local and had the skills to modify the plane.

Just something to think about.

[krw5927]

Originally Posted by N941WR

I hear you but since you are going to have to add a backup alternator and systems to feed your electric pump, you might as well look at all the other options.

I certainly don't mean to pick on you, Bill, but it is simply not true that a backup alternator is even required.

All airplanes with alternators have two redundant sources of electrical power: alternator and battery. For a simple VFR machine like the OP mentioned he's building, even an old, worn out PC-680 battery near the end of its life for cranking ability will be able to power a small fuel pump for a duration that will outlast the fuel supply, should a single alternator give up the ghost.

I do agree with your point on resale value.

The fact is that an all-electric fuel delivery system has been done successfully and safely by many on this forum. Sure, it's not a "standard", per-the-plans build (most RVs have at least one modification that is not exactly per the plans). But it's not a difficult or inherently unsafe modification, either. And there are ways to do it that are quite easy to change over in the future to a mechanical pump, should a buyer want that.

[N941WR]

Originally Posted by krw5927

...The fact is that an all-electric fuel delivery system has been done successfully and safely by many on this forum. Sure, it's not a "standard", per-the-plans build (most RVs have at least one modification that is not exactly per the plans). But it's not a difficult or inherently unsafe modification, either. And there are ways to do it that are quite easy to change over in the future to a mechanical pump, should a buyer want that.

I don't argue the point with you and if you read my prior post, I mention the use of a backup battery. The primary is at risk, along with the alternator, thus a properly isolated backup battery is a good thing.

My earlier point was that if the OP is going to an all-electric fuel delivery system, then why not look at other options such as an automotive type electronic fuel injection system? Or other systems.

If the OP is looking for a simple system, then stay with the tried and true. Even if he forgets to turn on the electric fuel pump for takeoff, chances are good that he won't realize it until he reaches down to turn off the already off fuel pump.

While many of us have differed from the plans, history has shown that most engine stoppages in the early life of EAB's are the result of changes to the fuel system.

When I discuss systems with new builders, one thing I strongly suggest they avoid is making changes to the "traditional" fuel delivery system.

[rightrudder]

I appreciate all input here. I've got a lot of time to weigh my decision, and ultimately I may spend more and take advantage of Van's discounted new Lycomings?especially if I go with the Sensenich metal prop for the combo deal.

I was thinking along the lines of KRW in that battery power alone would support an electric pump for quite some time. As for forgetting to turn the pump on, I'm a strong advocate of following the checklist in every phase of flight, so I don't think I'd overlook it. A setup that's safe is Priority No. 1, and I'm not averse to going the mechanical/boost pump route. Just weighing options.

Resale considerations are not huge for me. Goes against the whole "building the plane I want" mentality. EFIS would help with resale, but steam gauges are my thing, etc.

[Robski]

Since this thread ran down I've bought and rebuilt an O-320 E2D for my RV-6.

Bought a used accessory case, push rod and LH mag gear. Already had the nearly-new Lycoming fuel pump from my outgoing, very old, narrow deck, D2B.

It is a VERY easy change to the E2D to use the different accy case and bits with the fuel pump. The word 'modification' seriously overstates the change - it's using Lyc parts on a Lyc engine so there is nothing 'experimental' about it all.

If you get the crank and rods inspected, overhauled and balanced, cases etc. inspected, new cam and lifters, new piston assemblies, the cylinders suitably overhauled (if not new) and do the rebuild yourself an E2D can be a sweet, light, willing powerplant for sensible money (well under $10,000 all in).
The trick, if any, is to start with a complete engine that has only just 'retired' from regular use in its previous aircraft, still runs, and hasn't sat corroding for months or years!
Mine was 20 years / 3000 hours old and in regular use until a wooden prop strike a month before I bought it: it ran OK after strike / before rebuild using a spare prop.

So Doug, what did you decide?

[agirard7a]

I have an E2D in my 9 that I am building. I had the engine rebuilt.
Divco certified my case and in the process milled my accessory case for a fuel
Pump. It was not expensive and an easy fix.