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  #41  
Old 09-17-2015, 07:30 AM
eisnerrv4 eisnerrv4 is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Halifax, NS
Posts: 179
Thumbs up RV-4 Landing

I land my RV-4 exactly the same speeds and same style as Jim Rice does. I have almost 70 hours on her and haven't scared myself yet. I find if your patient with the RV-4 it settles in quite nice.
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  #42  
Old 09-18-2015, 09:43 AM
Nate-ISU Nate-ISU is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 51
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For what it's worth--

~130/hrs in my RV-4. Short gear, 0-320 w/fixed Wood prop. I had about 20/hrs TW about 5 years prior to first getting in a -4, then got an additional 5/hrs dual required by insurance. Except for those first few hours getting accustomed to a taildragger again, I never had issues with the -4. I don't have a lot of time in other types but the -4 almost seems too easy. Gobs of power and effective controls at low speeds.

For the first year and a half, I was pretty much exclusively wheelies--until I put a 225 lb person in the back and found that it took significant elevator to keep the tail up--that ended up being a pretty decent 3-pointer by accident. Since reading this thread back in June, I realized I needed to force myself out of my comfort zone and started working on three pointers.

Initially it was a little awkward because I had become so accustomed to the forward visibility, though it didn't take but a few trips around to get proficient. I like them both. There are definite advantages to landing 3-point and in all honestly, I'd argue is the better of the two.

Ultimately though, I'm with Smokey on this one. Short field? It's a 3-pointer. Otherwise? I prefer the wheelies for no good reason at all.
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  #43  
Old 03-26-2016, 09:48 AM
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acam37 acam37 is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Lufkin Tx
Posts: 689
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After 2-1/2 years I am finally flying my -4. Tailwheel crash course in a cub, then on to transition training with Alex in his RV-7. He taught me three point landings and I got pretty good. Now in my -4 the biggest problem for me is slowing it down on final. I have more go arounds than landings. My three points stink, so I tried a wheel landing. That seems to work for me right now. I hope I can learn how to get this plane slow enough on final so that I can get good three pointers. I guess practice makes perfect.
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RV-4 (N124TT) Sold
RV-8 (N269CP) Sold
RV-4 (N684ML) completed 3-17-19
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  #44  
Old 03-26-2016, 10:48 AM
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f14av8r f14av8r is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Tampa (Wimauma actually)
Posts: 421
Default Speed Target?

Hi Arlie,
What's your target speed crossing the threshold? As I worked on my landings over the last 9 months, I learned that carrying extra speed was a big negative. I normally cross the threshold at 65 knots. I add 5 knots for being heavy or gusty conditions but that's all. Getting slowed on base and keeping the speed under control on final was critical for me. Remember the old axiom, about the difficulty with going down and slowing down at the same time. That's really important in a slick aircraft with no deployable drag devices.

Be careful as you work it down. Below about 60 knots, you can set up some seriously high descent rates that would be difficult to correct without power.

I'm certainly no expert. I'm relating my limited experience as I've gone from zero RV / tailwheel time to about 120 hours and over 200 landings.

I really enjoy landing the -4 now. I'm sure you will too!
Randy
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RV-4 N212CS (sold)
RV-8 N184RK (flying)
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  #45  
Old 03-26-2016, 11:13 AM
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acam37 acam37 is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Lufkin Tx
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65 knots is roughly 75mph. I'm shooting for around 80 across the threshold but I usually wind up around 90-92mph. I only have 5 hrs in the plane and I'm still nervous flying it. It's feels like I'm going to fall out of the sky when I get it slow on final. I'm getting better with each flight, but right now the last 5 seconds before landing is still terrifying. I hope I'm not alone in this aspect of transitioning to the RV after only flying Cessnas and Cherokee's?
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RV-4 (N124TT) Sold
RV-8 (N269CP) Sold
RV-4 (N684ML) completed 3-17-19
KOCH Nacogdoches
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  #46  
Old 03-26-2016, 11:39 AM
Mjuckes Mjuckes is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Houston,MS
Posts: 63
Default Landings

Arlie. You are getting some good advice. You are probably too fast for decent 3 pointers. My 4 likes 70mph at threshold for 3's. Anything faster will grease a wheelie.. Just remember ,as others have said, anything under 65mph and sink rate will be high without power. With just a small amount of power you get down lower and shorter. Keep practicing!! Oh. Check your idle rpm I have mine set around 600rpm I found that if idle rpm is around 800 we float farther.
That's me anyway.
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  #47  
Old 03-26-2016, 12:35 PM
Johnnybgoode Johnnybgoode is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: NC
Posts: 112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acam37 View Post
65 knots is roughly 75mph. I'm shooting for around 80 across the threshold but I usually wind up around 90-92mph. I only have 5 hrs in the plane and I'm still nervous flying it. It's feels like I'm going to fall out of the sky when I get it slow on final. I'm getting better with each flight, but right now the last 5 seconds before landing is still terrifying. I hope I'm not alone in this aspect of transitioning to the RV after only flying Cessnas and Cherokee's?
Spend some time at 2000 or 3000' doing level configured slow flight. Negligible control feel difference between there and your RV down at sea level, until you get into ground effect. Climb to 5,000 and get a good full flap stall number. Give yourself 1.2 or so of that speed and do more slow flight. Cross the threshold between the 1.2x and stall speed, obviously closer to 1.2x speed. I find my -4 control feel changes a bit in ground effect but unless you carry way too much speed you transition through it to touchdown fairly quickly and predictably.
Once you get some basic numbers for your plane at different weights it's practice, practice, practice.
Good luck with the transition!
Patrick
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  #48  
Old 03-26-2016, 06:31 PM
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smokyray smokyray is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: TX32
Posts: 1,891
Default Roll it on....

Quote:
Originally Posted by acam37 View Post
After 2-1/2 years I am finally flying my -4. Tailwheel crash course in a cub, then on to transition training with Alex in his RV-7. He taught me three point landings and I got pretty good. Now in my -4 the biggest problem for me is slowing it down on final. I have more go arounds than landings. My three points stink, so I tried a wheel landing. That seems to work for me right now. I hope I can learn how to get this plane slow enough on final so that I can get good three pointers. I guess practice makes perfect.
Arlie,
After 25 years and one or two RV4 hours I'm deferring to the F16 Fighter Weapons school answer for anything: it depends!
Three point vs Wheel landing is an easy decision. Runway Surface and length determines approach and landing.
Turf, with obstacles and under 2K in length? Three point. 60knot approach with steep, high descent rate power on till touchdown approach. Retract flaps on touchdown, full aft stick with brakes.
Paved, prepared or smooth surface with no obstacles? Wheels landing, 65 knot approach with a tail low, full flap approach to a roll on with power wheels landing and hold tail off for style points till 5knot turnoff speed...
Questions?
V/R
Smokey
PS: My home strip for 10 years was. 1500' soft, rough turf strip with trees at both ends. I operated my RV4 and HR2 from it in every imaginable condition except snow. That said, what type approach depends on the surface.)

PSS: johnnybgoode: Thanks for your service. I too was privileged to serve my country and take some payback to AlQaeda in the delivery of 500 and 2000lb high explosive home renovation devices while flying another LM product, the coolest airplane on the planet IMHO, the F16C.

Last edited by smokyray : 03-26-2016 at 08:31 PM.
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  #49  
Old 03-27-2016, 07:18 AM
fixnflyguy fixnflyguy is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Winston-Salem, N.C.
Posts: 1,213
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I almost always land my -4 in 3 point..I like to be at 100 mph on downwind, throw flaps in abeam the numbers and bleed it down to 80 in the turn from downwind to final. I usually hold a little power on and and settle in short final 65-70, then ease power off. The -4 will drop like a rock below that, and you need to be ready to check up with a little back stick or shot of power to adjust. Any faster and you will float or need to wheelie. I have long gear, and often brush the TW just before mains with a backseater.
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  #50  
Old 03-27-2016, 08:49 PM
Whitman Whitman is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Allentown PA
Posts: 254
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smokyray View Post
Arlie,
After 25 years and one or two RV4 hours I'm deferring to the F16 Fighter Weapons school answer for anything: it depends!
Three point vs Wheel landing is an easy decision. Runway Surface and length determines approach and landing.
Turf, with obstacles and under 2K in length? Three point. 60knot approach with steep, high descent rate power on till touchdown approach. Retract flaps on touchdown, full aft stick with brakes.
Paved, prepared or smooth surface with no obstacles? Wheels landing, 65 knot approach with a tail low, full flap approach to a roll on with power wheels landing and hold tail off for style points till 5knot turnoff speed...
Questions?
V/R
Smokey
PS: My home strip for 10 years was. 1500' soft, rough turf strip with trees at both ends. I operated my RV4 and HR2 from it in every imaginable condition except snow. That said, what type approach depends on the surface.)

PSS: johnnybgoode: Thanks for your service. I too was privileged to serve my country and take some payback to AlQaeda in the delivery of 500 and 2000lb high explosive home renovation devices while flying another LM product, the coolest airplane on the planet IMHO, the F16C.
Minus all the LGPOS talk, listen to Smokey! I've been partial to 3 point landings over the last 3 years that I've flown the -4, but over the last year I finally started doing more wheel landings. Today, thanks to Smokey, I had my best wheel landing yet! Previously, I made the mistake of doing wheel landings at partial or zero flap. Today with full flaps, it rolled right on without the normal bounce I get! Thanks Smokey! Cheers!
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