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08-24-2015, 08:13 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Schaumburg, IL
Posts: 5,297
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New Engine Break-in: flakes in oil filter
my O-320 now has about two hours on it. I cut the oil filter and found some metal flakes. They look to be about .001" in size. I have 60's vintage steel cylinders with cast iron rings. The boring and honing was done 20 years ago, so a course hone, not the finer hones used today. These flakes seem normal to me for an initial break in run on a course honed engine. My partner thinks they may be too big.
Looking for an opinion from an expert. Hopefully this picture helps.
Thanks for your assistance.
Larry
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08-24-2015, 08:30 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Schaumburg, IL
Posts: 5,297
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Just realized this is really bad picture. The flash is reflecting off the oil and it looks like metal. Most of the metal can't be seen without light magnification.
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08-24-2015, 08:47 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Central IL
Posts: 5,516
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Larry, a little more about the history of the engine would be helpful. Was it overhauled, or has it been pickled for 20 yrs? Does it have a new oil cooler and hoses?
Freshly honed cylinders are to be washed with hot soapy water then oiled. This takes off the particles of cut metal. Other metal particles from machining operations find their way into the engine. A manufacturing operation has wash tanks with micron filters to clean the parts before assembly. Other shops typically don't. A little fuzz is typical in a new engine but should be gone after the first couple of oil changes. This is one reason the oil filter is replaced after the first 10 hours. (2hrs or 10hrs, not much difference if the debris is just washed off the interior) It might take three changes to completely clean the engine, if debris is the source.
You can take a magnet and sweep under the filter paper and see if it makes the particles stand up, salute and sparkle. If so, it is ferrous.
__________________
Bill
RV-7
Lord Kelvin:
“I often say that when you can measure what you are speaking about,
and express it in numbers, you know something about it; but when you
cannot measure it, when you cannot express it in numbers, your knowledge
is of a meager and unsatisfactory kind.”
Last edited by BillL : 08-24-2015 at 08:53 PM.
Reason: added sentence
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08-27-2015, 09:27 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Schaumburg, IL
Posts: 5,297
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Thanks Bill. I overhauled engine. Cylinders were done 20 years ago by Harrison, case was done by ECI. I did not wash the cylinders, only cleaned with solvents until towels were not showing grey. I did not clean the case after ECI's work as I trusted they flushed it good (maybe not a good idea). New cooler, hoses, etc. I could not get any of the flakes to stick to a magnet, so suspecting aluminum. The oil pump is stock, but it has new gears.
I took the filter to an old A&P and he wasn't very concerned. He suggested checking the filter again at 10 hours to confirm particle quantity was decreasing.
I was not concerned with eminent destruction, but my QP wouldn't do a second flight with me unless I got an expert opinion.
Larry
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08-27-2015, 10:28 AM
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Join Date: May 2014
Location: Savannah
Posts: 806
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It is common to see long, thin, curved aluminum shavings in the oil screen that are the result of the old style aluminum piston plugs wearing.
__________________
Mike Hammond
A&P IA PPL ASEL
RV-14A kit S/N 140170
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08-27-2015, 11:08 AM
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Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Gardnerville Nv.
Posts: 2,828
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Drift....IF.....I use any towel on and engine build, (usually just compressed air) I will use paper towels, the micro fibers will break down and flush out easier than a chunk of cotton strand. 
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7A Slider, EFII Angle 360, CS, SJ.
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08-27-2015, 11:40 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Central IL
Posts: 5,516
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lr172
Thanks Bill. I overhauled engine. Cylinders were done 20 years ago by Harrison, case was done by ECI. I did not wash the cylinders, only cleaned with solvents until towels were not showing grey. I did not clean the case after ECI's work as I trusted they flushed it good (maybe not a good idea). New cooler, hoses, etc. I could not get any of the flakes to stick to a magnet, so suspecting aluminum. The oil pump is stock, but it has new gears.
I took the filter to an old A&P and he wasn't very concerned. He suggested checking the filter again at 10 hours to confirm particle quantity was decreasing.
I was not concerned with eminent destruction, but my QP wouldn't do a second flight with me unless I got an expert opinion.
Larry
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You should be ok, but there is no definitive way to know. Just double your hours, then take off the filter and check again. With all the new oil supply stuff, at least you aren't getting any residual flakes downstream of the filter to damage bearings.
To Mikes post - we assume there is no ridge in the bores now, and what design style pin plugs do you have?
Bret - +1 - use hot tide and a bristle brush, ready to wash down with hot distilled water, blow dry, and add oil quickly.
__________________
Bill
RV-7
Lord Kelvin:
“I often say that when you can measure what you are speaking about,
and express it in numbers, you know something about it; but when you
cannot measure it, when you cannot express it in numbers, your knowledge
is of a meager and unsatisfactory kind.”
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08-27-2015, 01:01 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Secluded Lake,Alaska (AK49)
Posts: 359
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Lycoming guidance
Here is a service instruction that covers oil filter analysis.
http://www.lycoming.com/Portals/0/te...Inspection.pdf
I recommend running it again as prescribed after oil and filter change and check again. First run on an engine can turn up some pretty bizzare stuff!
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08-27-2015, 02:41 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Schaumburg, IL
Posts: 5,297
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillL
You should be ok, but there is no definitive way to know. Just double your hours, then take off the filter and check again. With all the new oil supply stuff, at least you aren't getting any residual flakes downstream of the filter to damage bearings.
To Mikes post - we assume there is no ridge in the bores now, and what design style pin plugs do you have?
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Std. pins with alum caps. they had very little wear from first 2000 hours and I re-used them. One of the pins had slight corrossion so I replaced it with a newer style pin with built in ends.
Larry
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08-27-2015, 03:30 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Valley Forge, Pa
Posts: 636
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lr172
Std. pins with alum caps. they had very little wear from first 2000 hours and I re-used them. One of the pins had slight corrosion so I replaced it with a newer style pin with built in ends.
Larry
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Problem,....... Can't mix pins with out replacing the opposing cylinder pin. These should all be up-graded to Heavy wall and your choice of plug end or the superior type with plug ends built in. Did you weigh your pistons to see how close a match they are? Most case shops leave the oil galley plugs out for you to clean before assembly
RHill
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