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05-26-2015, 10:57 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Defiance, MO
Posts: 1,674
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironflight
This topic gets debated regularly here and on other forums - I am glad to have earned something new this time around - the 5,000' AGL hard deck is a good reference number!
Paul
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Careful on the assumption of nothing below 5000 AGL. That is the hard deck for those still "participating". I have been in briefs that have the "return home" corridors to be at 500 AGL to ensure they are clear of those still "participating".
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Philip
RV-6A - 14+ years, 950+ hours
Based at 1H0 (Creve Coeur)
Paid dues yearly since 2007
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05-26-2015, 11:10 AM
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Keller, TX
Posts: 408
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plehrke
Careful on the assumption of nothing below 5000 AGL. That is the hard deck for those still "participating". I have been in briefs that have the "return home" corridors to be at 500 AGL to ensure they are clear of those still "participating".
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Also MTRs are usually 500 to 1500 AGL at speeds of 400kts or more....
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RV-10 N331JH 3rd owner (First flew in 2005, #15 flying)
Northwest Regional 52F
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05-26-2015, 11:38 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 525
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#40533 RV-10 Builder and CFI
1/2006 Started build
10/19/2011 First flight
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05-26-2015, 05:31 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: MKE
Posts: 1,519
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiefPilot
Good grief. I hope the powers that be planned to have a lot of "knock it off" calls during this time. This is one time I wouldn't blame GA pilots a bit for flying through a hot MOA.
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For the record, the events going on in the MOA were planned and known about before EAA made the decision to move the convention up a week and create the conflict. A bad move on EAA's part, but not a good reason to fly through the MOA unnecessarily. But I get your drift.
__________________
Jeff Point
RV-6, RLU-1 built & flying
Tech Counselor, Flight Advisor & President, EAA Chapter 18
Milwaukee
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05-26-2015, 06:15 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Lake Havasu City AZ
Posts: 2,393
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EAA
Quote:
Originally Posted by sprucemoose
For the record, the events going on in the MOA were planned and known about before EAA made the decision to move the convention up a week and create the conflict. A bad move on EAA's part, but not a good reason to fly through the MOA unnecessarily. But I get your drift.
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The Airventure future dates for 2104 thru 2020 were announced on Aug 29, 2013. Do you have documented proof of the MOA activity being planned prior to Aug 2013.
EAA did not "move up the dates". The dates follow a pattern going back at least to the early 60's.
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05-26-2015, 07:17 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Defiance, MO
Posts: 1,674
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LettersFromFlyoverCountry
Here's a timely reminder, then, that the MOA's just west of Oshkosh WILL be active during AirVenture this year. Plan accordingly.
Big war games planned that week.
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Should not be too restrictive as VOLK East is 8000 to 17999 ft. Need to be down well below that at enter the VFR arrival at Rippon.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrs14855
The Airventure future dates for 2104 thru 2020 were announced on Aug 29, 2013. Do you have documented proof of the MOA activity being planned prior to Aug 2013.
EAA did not "move up the dates". The dates follow a pattern going back at least to the early 60's.
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Surely people in high places in the military, FAA, and EAA are coordinating with each other since I know all three organizations list safety as a very high priority.
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Philip
RV-6A - 14+ years, 950+ hours
Based at 1H0 (Creve Coeur)
Paid dues yearly since 2007
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05-26-2015, 09:25 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: MKE
Posts: 1,519
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrs14855
The Airventure future dates for 2104 thru 2020 were announced on Aug 29, 2013. Do you have documented proof of the MOA activity being planned prior to Aug 2013.
EAA did not "move up the dates". The dates follow a pattern going back at least to the early 60's.
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No, I was just going by EAA's own statements on the matter. By their own admission they moved the dates up a week this year to better accommodate families who had to get kids back to school. The schedule has evolved over the years and changed many times, settling on the current Monday-Sunday schedule about a dozen years ago, but never this early.
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Jeff Point
RV-6, RLU-1 built & flying
Tech Counselor, Flight Advisor & President, EAA Chapter 18
Milwaukee
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05-26-2015, 09:48 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: New Smyrna Beach, FL
Posts: 1,339
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scard
I've all too often had "flight following" dump me like a hot potato if I chose to fly through a hot moa and not go the long way around. You can try, but you can't always please everybody. Again, a moa isn't restricted airspace.
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It would be interesting to hear from a controller on this. It has been my experience that with flight following, if you decide to go on and fly through an MOA that the controller has advised is hot, their procedure is to cancel flight following. That seems like a reasonable action to me. If I am told that an MOA is hot, I would not want to fly through it anyway. The controller will almost always suggest a heading, alternate altitude, or reroute to keep you clear of the hot airspace. I suspect that if you were IFR and the controller gave you a vector or a reroute because of a hot MOA, he would expect you to comply. Wonder what would happen if you refused the reroute while on an IFR clearance? I understand that it is perfectly legal to fly VFR through an MOA whenever you want to do so.
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David Maib
RV-10 N380DM
New Smyrna Beach, FL
VAF Paid 1/21/2020
"In '69 I was 21, and I called the road my own"
Jackson Browne
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05-26-2015, 10:31 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Lemoore (Fresno), CA
Posts: 132
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Another Hornet dude here...
I have often coordinated with the controlling agency to fly through a MOA if it's hot. Often you can get overflight (or more typically in GA, underflight) through a MOA.
For example, ATC would just come up to the fighters and ask if we could work 3,000 ft and above in the MOA, while someone transits below. While this could be a slight inconvenience depending on the mission at hand, it's much preferred to a panicked "knock it off" as we have a 500ft pass with uncalled traffic that nobody had SA to.
For the average GA pilot, our fighters are not as well equipped as you'd imagine. They have TACAN only, no TCAS or ADS-B, and the radar display is somewhat cryptic and must be pointed in the direction of the traffic you're looking at. If nobody cues you into traffic in a certain location, there's a good chance that it can go undetected. Not to mention that during BFM your attention is focused 90% outside the cockpit.
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08-10-2015, 03:58 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: McAlpin, FL
Posts: 253
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MOA SUA activity link
I know this thread is a little old, but I'm going to post this anyway! Here's a link that shows upcoming MOA and SUA activity on a map. Super easy to use. I saved the link in my "Aviation" folder on my iPad.
seeandavoid.org
Lance
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Lance Logan
McAlpin, FL
Plane at FL10
Scratchbuilt Biplane
Preceptor N3 - Sold
Zenith Zodiac 601HD - Sold (good riddance)
Kitfox IV - Sold my share, but loved that plane
RV8A Sold! Loved the plane, but not the nosewheel!
RVX (RV6/4) Sold
Cherokee 180 pickup truck
RV8 Fastback
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