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another paint booth

after a couple days it seems to flow out somewhat.

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supported with one wire. I should have used another as a backup but it worked. another part to store somewhere in the hangar. I am running out of space for parts. I recommend using safety wire to support parts for painting.
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anti-splat nose gear fairing, large pin holes, maybe too large for drywall compound but gave it a try because it is easy.

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other pin holes
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spray some color cards the paint store gave me, two coats. this was my first time to paint color cards. I am not sure if I did it correctly. I think the idea is to see the color difference the under color makes. Well, I don't see much difference. Lighting could be better.

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blue paint is trying to kill me. I put some acetone in the metal paint cup to slosh it around for cleaning and the lip popped off when gave it a wrist pop and faster than I could blink it hit me in the right eye. I was stunned for a couple seconds but the burning began and I made my way to the water bucket at the compressor and flushed my eye. I had rinsed some parts there before so the water wasn't clean but at that point I didn't care. my face was blue and I kicked the trash can a few times. I took a picture of my face to see if my eye was still there. I noticed I had blue paint dripping from my mouth. the next morning I woke up and my eye was frozen shut from the drainage. today it's better. hey, wear your safety glasses when handling paint!

I went home and told my wife what happened and she told me not to get paint on the carpet but to her credit she came over later and looked at my eye and called me a couple names, dumb ***, **** ****.

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wing tips, to be blue

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vent closed, electric heaters on
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vent open, vent fans on, flow is directed downwards towards the parts
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if you reuse DeKups, use these to prevent debris
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Steve - I've been following your thread as I'm getting ready to paint - keep it up.

I'm leaning toward Jet & Acryglo. Used Imron on the interior but can't get it locally anymore Also can't get Concept locally. My limited paint experience has been with conventional syphon feed guns but I now have a FLG4 HVLP gravity feed gun. Any tips on using this gun? Other than don't paint your face.
 
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Steve - I've been following your thread as I'm getting ready to paint - keep it up.

I'm leaning toward Jet & Acryglo. Used Imron on the interior but can't get it locally anymore Also can't get Concept locally. My limited paint experience has been with conventional syphon feed guns but I now have a FLG4 HVLP gravity feed gun. Any tips on using this gun? Other than don't paint your face.

I use the 15 tip for Concept paint and I bought an optional 22 tip for K36 sandable primer. I think the 18 tip that comes with the gun kit would work fine also for the sandable primer. the maximum recommended gun pressure seems to work better for cold days, 23 psi. that is 23 psi at the gun with the air trigger pulled. if the pressure gets too low you can have orange peel. if the pressure is much higher you will waste paint. for the final coat I open my trigger adjustment screw 3-4 turns open. wear safety glasses any time you work with paint. Concept paint has iso-cyanates so get filters for this or a fresh air supply. I am on my second mask filter set and I am still painting piece parts. the 3M full face mask is very good and I use the peelable visor screens and have replaced two so far. and don't paint your face blue, but if you do have some water around to be able to flush your eyes. be as considerate as you can to others around because some folks are sensitive to painting. I will get some pictures of my vent fan exhaust that are sitting outside the hangar on the concrete. there are a couple of streaks of exhaust paint on the concrete but really it is not much. I was told by a couple of hangar neighbors that it was nothing to worry about.
 
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Thanks for the tips Steve. I do have a full face breathing air mask and my booth is half of a two car attached garage & workshop in the country so I shouldn't bother anyone except maybe the squirrels. I expect to be moving enough air that my wife who is pretty sensitive to my shop odours won't notice. Hope to get at it soon as my scheme designer (son) comes up with something that I am actually capable of putting on the plane.
 
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drywall compound mixed results. the nose gear fairing with the very large pin holes left the surface low so if you have very large holes use something else. for the main gear fairing I used primer then direct to drywall compound without scuffing. the fill wasn't very good and then a beginner mistake by applying extra sandable primer and the drywall compound lifted to the surface. so the conclusion is apply drywall compound to a well scuffed surface so it has something to hang on to and do not wet coat. the nose gear fairing that was scuffed before drywall compound turned out well.

there are those low spots from the large pin holes filled with drywall compound
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the main gear fairing were a mess, behind on the table
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wing tips blocked sanded, using a soft pad and the rolled scotch-brite both wrapped with some flexible 320. 320 is my final sand grit for everything. some folks like 400 or even 600 but so far I don't see the need. the paint is thick and feels like plastic when you pick up a part after a couple days. after one day the paint is still very soft so be careful not the scratch it before it cures. after a week it is hard. for example, I was painting several parts on consecutive days and stood an elevator against the wall after one day cure. it stuck to the wall. no damage done so then I put one day cured parts on black plastic. they don't stick to black plastic. go figure. also, there seems to be significant hardness change between 24 and 36 hrs. I will buff the paint after 6 months.

I noticed in this picture I have a ridge line from the block sanding. I need to take a look at that.
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this one looks ok.
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final surface primer, these are going to be nice if I don't screw up painting the blue color. I will use the white primer as undercoat since the bottom of the plane will be white for the blue bottom color. two coats should be enough by examination of the color cards I painted earlier.
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colors, Chevy white and Regiment blue
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new plastic on the table, that solvent bottle on the table is useful and a pump for the reducer can (not shown) is good
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the patient is on the table. I have been dreading this one. hopefully my new skills acquired will help me recover it as I hacked it up earlier.
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outside paint streaks. fans are located about four feet from the door. the fans are on independent circuits in case of a failure. one fan can pull negative pressure in the booth. the marks close to the door are dust. I thought about placing some plastic at the vent fan exhaust to catch the streaks but didn't want to have plastic blowing around because I have an AirCare helicopter within 100 ft. I have some kick plates to cover those big holes in the door when I am finished painting.

HVLP reduces overspray and saves paint compared to conventional guns I used 35 years ago.

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wing tips, vertical surfaces, orange peel, I hope these flow out and heal themselves, warmer today, first coat 80F in the booth, second coat 72F, end of second coat 68F. 15 minutes between coats. maybe I could cut the time between coats and get better flow out but I am concerned about solvent pop. I used DT870 for cooler temps because I didn't want to get any runs on these flexible parts and have to sand them out or maybe I am chicken. DT885 is the next higher temp reducer. I will need to buff these out in six months after the paint becomes hard, but not too much buffing because only two coats of paint on these. I think I need to control the distance from the gun to the part better. I was closer when painting the leading edges and they had less orange peel. Also, I used two coats of white primer thinned with acetone. that probably didn't help. next time... I will use the primer as a sealer and mix with reducer (that's a published PPG option) when I just need to cover color and probably just one coat since the blue covers well.

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paint comments

Steve,
I stumbled on to this thread by accident. Otherwise I would have commented sooner.I have really enjoyed your comments and pictures on your process.

When I started my painting journey I could not get anyone who had gone before to give me any tips on using Concept so I went through much of your trials and tribulations with the paint and more.

Here are my comments for anyone contemplating painting their own plane.

Paint Booth.
10 foot width is too small. Mine was 10 x 20 x 8. Too narrow. Once you are painting PPG in full suit and fresh air system, getting around the booth is a major aggravation. I did mine inside a T hangar so I had no choice. But I made some compensations.

I think most people over think the inflow/outflow business. I used 5 20/20" pleated furnace filters for intake high on one end and a cheap box fan (gasp explosion hazard!) low on other end. The fan was adjusted so that there was some airflow but I was not sucking air from unwanted areas. When you are painting only parts of the plane with an HVLP gun you won't generate that much overspray so it was not a problem for me.

Here is a picture of doing the wings. Notice the narrow width. I had to rotate the wings to do the paint then rotate them upright to get around them. There is very little room to do the back of the surface.
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Doing the fuselage.
I commandeered a derelict rotisserie used to make dirt-track race cars to be able to rotate the fuselage. 45 degrees from horizontal allowed me to lay down an even layer of paint from one side. Use cheap plastic drop cloths for the floor and wet them down thoroughly before painting. No dust and paint does not stick to floor. Here is the rotisserie and the narrow quarters.
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Fuselage painted and cleaned up.

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I used PPG primer. It would orange peel very easily. I found that thinning it with acetone (per instructions) helped quite a bit. If you leave any irregularities that occur in the primer they will be magnified by the paint coat.

Paint
PPB Concept was a great choice for me. One step process. Less weight. But very expensive. Able to cut and buff the errors out. Forget the standard "you have to do a flash coat to keep the paint sticking and not have any runs." BS. I had the best results with just full two coats of paint. Apply til you think its going to run. Apply to horizontal surfaces(real important). Adjust your part to make it happen. By the time you have put the first coat on the part and refilled the gun, its time to do the second coat.

I had a big problem with orange peel before I learned the tricks. If you use too fast a reducer or spray from too high, or go too fast, you will get orange peel. The first day it looks like it is flowing out but then the paint will begin to really dry and the orange peel will come back. I had to force myself to slow down and let the paint really flow out of the gun to get a good wet coat. Check the temperature and stick with the reducer recommended for that temp. Err if any on the low side so it doesn't come out dry. In my experience 8" is way to high for the gun to be above the surface. YMMV. I may have added just a little extra reducer to thin the paint, I can' recall. Didn't use a viscometer??

I talked with PPG reps a couple of times. As IR, you have to wait one,two weeks before doing any cut,buff, or polishing. The rep told me to get it all done before 90 days, but I have done some long after that with decent results. The cut, buff and polish will change the appearance of the paint job, so unless you are doing some kind of clear coat, you cannot just buff an area. The cutting process destroys some of the really nice depth look of the Concept paint. The result is not unacceptable just different. So take that into account.

I have 5 HVLP guns, all cheapos. They all work. The horrible freight gun that I got when they were still made in Taiwan is the best of the lot. If I had to do it over, I would get a better, high quality gun.

I used a final disposable screw-on water filter just below the gun. No water problems. My 33 gallon tank was not enough. You need lots of air so that the pressures stay constant till you can stop and let the air compressor catch up.

Dave A.
 
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that is slick. I think you're right about orange peel. Gun to be closer, paint to be thinner, reduce to higher temp if you're boarder line and slow down to put it on wet...... but don't slow down too much or it will run.

I agree with your comments.
---I had the best results with just full two coats of paint. Apply til you think its going to run. Apply to horizontal surfaces(real important). Adjust your part to make it happen. By the time you have put the first coat on the part and refilled the gun, its time to do the second coat.---

these improved slightly. I can live with them for now.

bad camera
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I added some DT885 reducer to the primer to see the results. it made the primer look like glass but I forgot to use the strainer for the gun and blew some chunks on to the parts and saw a few pin holes I missed. I had to stop. Fix them tomorrow. Some other "internet" guy mentioned if you use the DT885 with the primer you will get die back if you don't wait 24 hrs before paint so that is a trade off if the that guy is right.

Primer with reducer instead of acetone flows on like glass, more like a sealer.

there is a "chunk" of dried primer in this one towards the top

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<snip>I will need to buff these out in six months after the paint becomes hard,
<snip>

Steve, it has been many years since I researched this, but my recollection, and what I've always done, is cut and buff soon after you paint, say after 48 hours. The paint is still flexible and the results are superb with a minimum amount of buffing required with a gentle compound.

If you wait many weeks, the paint hardens and becomes more difficult to buff, matter of fact you must use a more aggressive finishing compound. Keep in mind body shops are cutting and buffing mere hours after they shoot the paint and Concept is designed for that environment.

Your plane is looking great! Painting an airplane is a huge job....
 
Looking good...

A few positive things…

…….You are at the painting stage in the build process
…….You are STILL painting in OHIO……… in DECEMBER ...WOW
…….It’s looking GREAT.
…….You WILL say “I painted it myself”…with pride

While nowhere nearly as professional as your booth, I managed to get a 30’ airplane. You know, Looks good from 30’ . Most say closer :D

Don’t forget to leave your wings in the dining room to thoroughly dry….:)

I can’t wait to see your finished airplane.


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I even made Van’s calendar this year…. “Miss March”

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At what stage of construction are you? Have you done the engine, brake and fuel installation so all the holes are done, and you just stripped everything off to paint? Or will do you all that work with the fresh paint and hope you don't damage it?

I am at the stage where I have to start thinking about that and I am weighing pros and cons. If the engine isn't on then I can put the fuse on a rotisserie which is very attractive.

Thanks for sharing your experiences. It really helps since I will be biting the bullet and painting it myself. And it is a rather daunting task, but I enjoy painting models, so this should just be way more joy and way more money down the tubes when I screw up!! :p
 
Steve,
Your paint job is looking really good, and best of all, you get the satisfaction of knowing you did it yourself.

I am spoilt, only on the empennage priming, but have access to a professional booth for my painting. This makes life really easy.

Keep up the good work! I can't wait to see the finished aircraft.

Cheers,

Joe
 
cleaning solvent around rivets affects primer on these fiberglass parts, cleaning solvent drying time was 15 minutes at 75F. also, I used reducer with the DPLF primer to act as a sealer. basically a test. I noted after 24 hrs that when scuffing, the pad gumming and leaving sticky hard particles that were difficult to remove. the only option was to coat with a light coat of sandable primer and redo. I returned to the pure acetone and primer for the next round.

Acryli-Clean DX330 left weeping marks around rivets in fiberglass. be careful with this. I used it on the horizontal stab and it was fine. smells like kerosene. After redoing these parts I didn't use this stuff. it does make a nice clean part before painting and may reduce dirt attraction but I will not use it again for fiberglass parts. I would consider selling it, $50.

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These were actually worse than the photos show. Be careful with DX330 around rivets.
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small parts, a good place to practice technique, hold the part in your hand and have some fun, I felt like Picasso! first coat booth temp 80F, second coat 72F, end of painting 68F, DT870 slightly thinned by an extra two reducer container caps amount. gun closer to the parts. my best painting so far. I painted the long fairing swung horizontal and I could rotate and it was perfectly smooth (pictures taken). after about 5 minutes after hanging vertical I noticed some minor orange peel developing on it's own. so, the conclusion is the paint will orange peel from a smooth condition by itself when changing from horizontal to a vertical orientation but I believe it will be minor. as said before, you can have a better paint finish if you orient the parts horizontal.

this was a smooth finish painting horizontal
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slight orange peel developing because of hanging vertical. maybe my paint is too cold. when I painted over my gloved hand the paint seemed very cold. could the cold paint contribute to orange peel? paint temp = 60F before mixing.
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these look ok, cheap fairings, no pin holes, these were both easy to install and paint
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Yea, Acyri-Clean DX-330 works great for cleaning bare metal before scuffing and before etching/ alodining. I don't use it any time as a post sanding solvet. I use a post sanding wipe down solvent made by House of Color and there are other brands. Even then, you must be careful to do manageble blocks so the solvent is completely wiped away and not allowed to dry on the surface. No problems from weeping around rivets or sheet metal laps. For me, this step is mandatory between sandings. Follow that with a last minute pass with a tack rag and you're ready to spray.
Also, I would never mix cold paint, make sure it has acclimated to spray booth temps before mixing. If working in a cold hanger has its problems, like sucking in cold aid through the paint booth making choosing the right reducer a **** shoot.
Like many of us, I learned these tips from a lot of hard knocks over the years as I am a self professed jack leg.

Kelly Landrum
Halifax,Va.
 
ok, makes sense, paint temperature to be same as booth temperature. I need to raise the paint temp from 60F to 75F before mixing.
 
Steve, it has been many years since I researched this, but my recollection, and what I've always done, is cut and buff soon after you paint, say after 48 hours. The paint is still flexible and the results are superb with a minimum amount of buffing required with a gentle compound.

If you wait many weeks, the paint hardens and becomes more difficult to buff, matter of fact you must use a more aggressive finishing compound. Keep in mind body shops are cutting and buffing mere hours after they shoot the paint and Concept is designed for that environment.

Your plane is looking great! Painting an airplane is a huge job....

OK, I'll look at DH cut and buff post and buy some materials. I need to go after the underside of the elevators where I tried the three coat method, mist coat, then medium second and heavy final coat. That didn't work as well as two wet coats. From then on I used the two wet coat method. .... and buff the wing tips.
 
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the long gear leg fairings developed slight orange peel when left hanging vertical. I painted these horizontal and they were perfectly smooth. the paint gun did not cause orange peel. it was simply the vertical orientation. the small fairing more horizontal surfaces (where it fairs for the attachment holes) are smooth. for this case, my conclusion is orange peel was simply caused by the paint flowing downhill. there are probably other causes for orange peel.

before, just after painting
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two days after painting, hanging vertical
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priming, left over grey primer, two years old, to be white when it's over, all hinges taped

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pins inserted so as now to damage hinges, safety wired to the pins
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K36, I had primed these two year ago before first flight, I didn't use any reducer because I didn't know what I was doing (like I know what I'm dong now...) they held up well but had a very rough finish. adding reducer improves the finish. this was with DT885 even though it was only 70F in the booth. outside air temp 8C.
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a way to hold this open for painting, it worked, only slight movement from the air pressure
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working environment, it's tight
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discoloration from lower cowl heat, for reference when applying new foil, line where foil ended evident
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top cowl. I heated the paint and reducer to 70F before mixing by placing in a box in front of an electric heater. I heated the hangar to 24C and the booth temp for the first coat was 80F and finish painting booth temp was 70F. I used DT885 reducer to try to get a nice smooth finish. I painted the part upside down. the warm paint was thinner, had better flow and was overall easier to work with. added that to my checklist. towards the aft I managed to loose the paint line and also got the gun to close and saw the effects of paint "swoosh" in all directions from the air pressure. I thought I had ruined it but slowly it began to heal itself. other than this defect I'm happy with it.

also, the day before I forgot to clean my gun after K36. that took a full hour to clean. another painful lesson.

the "swoosh" run is just behind the reflection of the wire. I will get another picture of this tomorrow to see the effects of gravity overnight.
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WET PAINT!

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I made one adjustment to door while painting by squeezing the wire to eliminate the door paint blocking on the hinge line and left it more horizontal for curing.
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reduced orange peel on vertical surface. no paint build up around hinges.
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well, the paint "swoosh" didn't heal itself. it was just too much to ask. I determined I must have been following the V-line from the nose and it piled there. this one will need post paint work. bummer.

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soldiering onward, bottom cowl. heated paint to 70F, DT885, paint booth at first coat 80F, end of second coat 70F

scratch hanging part, I don't know how I did this. it had to be the safety wire. I bent all the safety wire ends back after that, like I should always do. this one got me.

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red putty
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where scratch was
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I should have filled this rivet
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fairing looks good, no immediate orange peel, urethane likes to be room temp, cold paint goes on too thick and can cause orange peel when hanging to cure. I'll post of picture of this tomorrow to see the overnight effects

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first painted piece installed, the white appears grey from the side, humm

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can-o-pee primed with sandable primer, a pain to fair the fiberglass transition, I made four separate wooden contour blocks for sanding

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inlet filters. all piece parts completed except canopy. canopy to be painted today then the booth is to be rotated to the fuse.

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Intake

Did you end up providing an air intake? I had to keep the plastic from getting sucked in around the plane and getting weird airflow.
 
no, I did not have an air inlet fan. I wrapped the plastic around completely and overlapped on the floor. I needed to put something on the floor or it would rise. I used a 2x4 but a thin floorboard over the entire floor would be better. I have a 7 ft. wide booth. 8 ft wide would have been better. then use 4 x 8, 1/4 inch floorboard.
 
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I left some green Imron primer (interior painted with Imron) around the screws of the canopy side and they bubbled with PPG DPLF primer. PPG primer has acetone as a thinner. If you don't use acetone to thin the primer surface is not as smooth. Washed off with acetone and repeated, 15 minute delay, another lesson. the can-o-pee got three coats of paint. first time to paint three coats. I let the second coat flash for 20 minutes before painting the third coat. three coats looks slightly smoother but I used a more paint but this is a small part. two coats would have been fine for this part but I had extra paint in the gun. for the wings and fuse I will use two coats. DT885 reducer, booth temp at first coat 80F, end of third coat 68F.... warm today. outside air temp 58F.

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big rain today
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this was the end of the second coat
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end of third coat, no significant difference
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curing primer with electric fans on high. booth expands slightly on the sides like a balloon. also, I modified the door hold open device with a rope strung from the top to allow for getting big parts in and out easier vs the rod from the floor method. the canopy was wall to wall. 8ft booth width would be better than 7ft.

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booth rotated 90 degree easily. I brought in the babe. rope used to swing the light for clearance. still deciding if I should raise it one foot to be 8ft. I will extend the booth 10ft to get the tail. still thinking how best to get the plastic through the wing. I'm thinking about raising the lights to be above the wing. need another pair of lights. wood as protection against a dropping pvc pipe but we managed without dropping a pipe. I will add the rope cross ties and use some strong duct tape at the upper pipe joints. I shook a lot of **** out of those flexible ducts.

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piMdhVeY_JWCtd6xEN7U7Yt8-nSY4iPBd3plHJKoETpXTbwPrWMJNhNwKBdeYs9rvZJuofiwij8gnBggqIKc-q2qFZ3bOMxjNGNpXFg4uTyRZQCfoBRCUxfoprSnB8tiQWhWvUAew-60PXO3RTrMRvIllhKbx1feNnPB2z8Q2Ybx_sCfGAaoVnD9xaKOG0BF-GVL8t3K9-EQlI3PdSlWLTtVe215hxIs7qqlSbG6uxvYdDC90FkSzxSFpHGM2zBfHyFRr6bYtoWQ6mGf-Ztkmpjz4NIC-pkBUUXL68gmWhREBxGKh-D6ZZ5gHSkEayjrD06GnPRqPGLVmpXn5lpAT4RNiQAdbqDP7i5xrCrV5NSsG62nO21xcM37oFW90Ywmfnale1-jgpCIt9n4GPqW5P94igvqZIFTBe7ZzPzCD_ZcK2eUvUM1eAfyPZS4bIH4wHVrQtMCaGFOoGHzlp2cn42M5qewoibjFFMtb7HaeAoq89D7iKJCHsgkTiDQ26sGyp67CO-do_SLK52xGLPXa44Q77Akv-NjnBHD9KVJt8AJ4PEg4eGi3qiR_b0Sx4c7bv85=w991-h743-no


no overspray detected after completing phase 1, this was the coupon located adjacent to the booth door
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raised one foot to be 8ft. what I need around the wing is a contoured clam shell with a soft pad interface to the wing. I may try 4 inch polystryrene, the blue stuff.

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I've been reading this thread with interest and I'd like to offer an 'outside the box' observation. I believe there is a much easier and less expensive way to paint an airplane. But, I know I will have tomatoes thrown at me...

I've painted two airplanes. Both were tube-and-fabric but both had a lot of aluminum and fiberglass parts.

No one here is interested in painting the fabric so I'll leave that part out. But for the aluminum, it was simple and cheap. I scuffed the parts (alum gear fairings, wings struts, trim tabs, canopy bow frame, etc...) with a scotch bright pad, cleaned it off with cheapo alcohol, sprayed it with two-part epoxy primer, and then top coated it with Superflite paint. Done! I didn't use or need any aluma-whatever or any other expensive and dangerous chemical cocktail to 'prep' parts.

I used a Citation HVLP and the parts came out perfect. No orange peel and no runs. For as long as I had the airplanes the painted parts were tough as nails. No paint peeled and no paint chipped. In fact, the paint was very difficult to scratch.

If I recall, a gallon of epoxy primer was around $60. I read somewhere in this thread a guy paid $1,100 for 1.5 gallons of PPG?!?!

For fiberglass parts, there's no way you're going to get all the pin holes out before you prime it. Fill what you can...shoot a coat of epoxy primer...and then fill the holes. I used a cheap red filler that comes in a little tube from Autozone. My wheel pants and cowl had ZERO pin holes. I'm either really awesome or my bone-simple technique just works well!

It's my observation that the RV folks seem to make things as complicated as can possibly be! I can surmise why, but I won't post that here.

Anyway, it's just something to think about. I really don't think painting has to be as difficult as people make it.

I've currently packed my RV-7 away to build a Zenith Cruzer on amphib floats and so far my plan is to paint the entire airplane with two-part epoxy primer and Superflite paint. I think that's the least expensive way to go that will still provide a fantastic finish.

Oh, and the other thing I wanted to mention if it concerns you, the primer and paint went on extremely thin and smooth! So don't think that it's going to add more weight to the plane than PPG or anything else. I was really impressed with how thin and shiny it came out.

Primer on my S-6S wheelpants as described above...http://www.ransclan.com/30jun10.htm

Paint on my S-6S wheelpants as described above...http://www.ransclan.com/8jul10.htm

Finished Wheel Pants...http://www.ransclan.com/1aug10.htm

Priming Cowl...http://www.ransclan.com/25sep10.htm

Paint on Cowl...http://www.ransclan.com/27sep10.htm

Finished Cowl (look how shiny it is!)...http://www.ransclan.com/Log Pages/6oct10.htm
 
your paint looks better than mine. difficult to know which paint to choose. my posts are for info only using the PPG Concept, FLG4 gun and a hangar setup for a first time HVLP painter in the cold season. maybe I need to go back to the Citation HVLP that I borrowed to paint the overall primer but it's difficult to paint upside down and I had some drips from that gun. perhaps the drips were from a faulty seal that could be corrected.
 
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Epoxy Primer

Mark, could you please list the details of the epoxy primer. I'm looking to follow your lead. Manufacturer and primer by catalog number would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Ed Eliiot
 
What I did

Steve,
I painted my -4 DIY as you are. I am in the aircraft business, and have painted several cars, so I may have a slight edge, but I'm no pro. I used PPG epoxy primer, DP40, which is a very easy to use primer, can be sanded if needed, and is compatable with Aluminum,Steel, and Glass. It is easy to find at auto supply stores. I did my topcoat with PPG Desothane, which is widely used by the airlines for the big boys. It is a single stage urethane and works very well, and can be cut and buffed if needed. In lieu of the PVC booth, I built a 24'x24' frame of 2x4's , 8' tall, and suspended the center of the 4 cross pieces with rope from my hangar ceiling so it was open span. I left the front open with 4' spacing on vertical pieces for the other 3 sides. I made a "roll up" door with a PVC tube at the bottom so I could move the plane in and out. This was also a great place to work in winter, and it heated with a kero heater a lot better than the whole hangar. I taped in place 10 heater filters at the top of the roll up door, and put 3 exhaust fans at the back lower edge of the enclosure which I vented out of the hangar.The booth took a weekend to build, and worked great. I have less than a grand in my paint job, and 7 yrs. later it still looks perfect (except the couple party fouls I know of). Yours is coming along great, and you will be proud to say you did it yourself!
 
E.D Eliot-on my S-10 I used the PolyFiber two-part epoxy primer: http://www.polyfiber.com/products/ep420epoxyprimergreenorwhite.htm

On my S-6 I used all Superflite. I just looked on the Superflite website and things have changed a little. For one, it's a LOT more expensive than I remember when I used it back in 2010. It looks like it's now $213/gal plus the catalyst and reducer. http://www.superflite.com/c-1097-metal-primer.aspx Expensive but it sure beats $1,100!

Having used both of the primers, I found them to be exactly the same to mix and use with one being no better or worse than the other. They both went on super smooth and nice.

Steve-I was always happy with the primer/paint I've used, but was never a real fan of the Citation HVLP. It seems like any time I would tip the gun at any angle other than straight up and down, I'd get some weird spray results or drips out of the gun.

I'm not recommending the HVLP at all in my previous post. I was just giving food for thought about how I used a much less expensive primer/paint and had excellent results.

In fact, I don't want to use the HVLP on my Cruzer. I'd love to have a 'real' paint gun but I'd have to buy a large compressor and then add 220 to my garage. Currently, if I turn on more than three light bulbs in my garage I'm blowing fuses so there's no way it would handle the large compressor needed to paint!
 
thx for the info. the downside to PPG Concept is the cost. it is very expensive. also, PPG Concept contains isocyanate and you need fresh air or mask filters for this. mix ratio for Concept is 4:1:2 so one gallon of paint makes 1.75 gallon mixed. I have used one gallon of paint (1.75 mixed) for all of the piece parts but since I only completed a part or two at time I wasted some paint but not much. my compressor is 110V. I purchased an added aux air tank to bring the total to three aux tanks for the painting the fuse. One Harbor Freight aux tank $32 with coupon. the aux tanks are rated to 125psi. my compressor is rated to 150psi. I don't run over 100 psi in the aux tanks and I conduct a pressure check to 125 psi before use with the aux tanks outside the hangar.

since I will have blue on the fuse bottom I will paint the upper fuse and sides white then tape a line and paint the lower fuse and bottom blue. after the blue I will paint a couple stripes.
 
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Steve maybe your setup would work for me. Can you post come pics of how you have the compressors set up?
 
Thanks Marc

Mark, sent polyfiber a short e-mail with a few questions today - received an answer a few hours later - That is customer service!

I appreciate your fast and on-point answer to my questions. Looks like I need some more info from polyfiber but it looks really good at this point. Thank you again sir.
 
Steve maybe your setup would work for me. Can you post come pics of how you have the compressors set up?

I'll post some more pics of the compressor and aux tank setup (now three aux air tanks). Aux tank idea is from Sam. I don't believe my air setup would be enough for painting the entire plane but painting in sections I think it will be sufficient.

this is no longer acceptable, Imron paint applied four years ago to the interior with a non HVLP gun. applied heavily to these top rails and left in the sun on a hot summer day. I didn't let it flash properly between coats and created huge solvent pop. it looks like it exploded. I'll repaint these top rails and the roll bar fwd side and hopefully do a better job this time. the Imron paint is tough stuff and the remainder of the interior is good. if there is one thing I have learned is that you must let each coat flash or you risk solvent pop.

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only good method to correct huge solvent pop is to grind it down
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heavy paint scratches on roll bar, both sides same location, must be from the canopy, I finally connected the dots, duh. originally I thought I must have been a shoe or a Texas belt buckle. I have white plastic guides (removed in this picture) but I still get these scratches. perhaps beveling the canopy edges would help? is this a common problem or is this Imron paint not as tough as I thought? is the aft edge of the canopy actually making contact with the fwd side of the roll bar upon closure? if so, that could lead to a broken canopy corner. does this occur upon opening or closing? a lot of questions?

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proseal, never installed at canopy leading edge and I get water ingress in the rain. hope this treatment helps.
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more proseal to the inside, need to clean up the Byonics wiring hanging on the right side, one thing leads to another..... this is the first time the panel has been out since first flight over two years ago, able to remove it within 30 minutes. a chance to give everything a good look under there.
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spider web
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exhaust duct fitting
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door #1
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door #2
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fuse booth enclosed, still need to seal the upper overlap and a few other places

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will add more lighting fwd and under

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jack wing one inch, one at a time, and pull plastic under wheels and straighten, takes 5 minutes

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suck down test with slits cut for doors, negative pressure evident, booth is not completely sealed yet

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wing seal

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Steve maybe your setup would work for me. Can you post come pics of how you have the compressors set up?

my setup, pump spray bottle with water for floor to the right. for winter I need 25ft of hose before the vertical separator to condense the water out of the line, it's coiled on the floor and I splash some water on it for added cooling. two water separators, one at the vertical pipe exit and another at the aux tank exit. I think this setup is sufficient for painting sections, one wing, one fuse, etc. not the overall airplane.

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Hey Steve and others,
What has always worked well for me shooting single stages or for that part any catalized paint or clears is to test the flash off time between coats by doing the fingertip touch test by pressing your fingertip into the previous coat on a spot which is on the masking immediately adjacent to the tape off line. When you lift your finger you should not see any fine stringing, but should should still feel a little tacky. If stringy, wait some more. When it is no longer stringy, it is time to shoot the next coat. This tactic gives perfect dwell time between coats every time.
Avoid laying it on heavy. It just yields a softer finish that is easily bruised.

For a good looking corner/edge protector, run out a length of clear laminated P-Touch Brother label printer tape and install on the corner of the canopy rail after paint has cured well. This makes a beautiful and almost undetectable installation.

Kelly
 
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