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Finish kit delays - frustrating

Been patiently waiting but now have to vent a little and co-miserate with fellow finish kit orderers.

Ordered finish kit 7/7/21 - still waiting. It's hard to believe it's been 16 months...they now tell me I'm 10th out of 12 they're crating (been crating for months). Don't have any hair left to pull out - this is entering pathetic. It's been crating "in about 2 weeks" for the last 4 months.

Anyone else get one recently? There's gotta be 10 of you out there that have been waiting > 16 months but that's hard to believe. Starting to think they don't like me or something.

Never thought I'd have to dust the tail and fuselage off so much waiting for the finish kit...something to do I guess.

Dreaming of flying someday....
 
It was the middle of June 2021 when I called Van's to place my order for the entire kit. When they answered how long before I could expect to begin receiving deliveries I put my order on hold and started looking for a completed RV-12iS. Luckily I located one just completed and the A&P builder/owner listed it for sale. We closed the deal on June 28, 2021.

The lead time for receiving kits was just going to be too long. I would still enjoy building and am considering the RV-15. I wonder how long it will be to receive kit components for one of those!
 
Been patiently waiting but now have to vent a little and co-miserate with fellow finish kit orderers.

Ordered finish kit 7/7/21 - still waiting. It's hard to believe it's been 16 months...they now tell me I'm 10th out of 12 they're crating (been crating for months).

Ordered my finish kit 6/1/21 Got the kit delivered 2 weeks ago. It has some significant back orders. - engine mount extensions, flap motor, a few landing gear parts. But I am back building.

Paul Fisher
 
Been patiently waiting but now have to vent a little and co-miserate with fellow finish kit orderers.

Ordered finish kit 7/7/21 - still waiting. It's hard to believe it's been 16 months...they now tell me I'm 10th out of 12 they're crating (been crating for months). Don't have any hair left to pull out - this is entering pathetic. It's been crating "in about 2 weeks" for the last 4 months.

Anyone else get one recently? There's gotta be 10 of you out there that have been waiting > 16 months but that's hard to believe. Starting to think they don't like me or something.

Never thought I'd have to dust the tail and fuselage off so much waiting for the finish kit...something to do I guess.

Dreaming of flying someday....

I feel your pain, yesterday was the 10 month anniversary of my avionics kit order. If you haven’t ordered your avionics do not delay it will be a year wait.
 
From this article published today:

https://www.flyingmag.com/vans-rv-12is-slsa-they-build-it-you-fly-it

"Van’s Aircraft has perfected the process of designing, manufacturing, and shipping airplane kits for its RV line of E/AB models. Hughes says the Van’s parts picking and crate packing teams ship between 65 and 80 “sub-kits” each week all over the world. “An RV-7 has four sub-kits for the wings, empennage, fuselage, and finishing. So 80 sub-kits in theory represent about 20 airplanes. Just to give you some historical reference, we were shipping half that amount just a year ago,” he said."
 
Delays

My Finish Kit was ordered on 5-19-21. Final payment was requested on 7-21-22 and delivery was on 9-15-22. As others, I had, and still have, numerous backordered parts. A couple are required to mount the main gear legs so I can get the Fuselage on the ground before proceeding. So... as of today, that is 536 days or 17.5 months AND WAITING! As much as I enjoy the building process, like another post here, I too would have just bought a flying plane had I known. By the way, I just received my Power Plant Kit. AGAIN, numerous backordered parts. I know we all suffered through Covid, however..... I wish Van's could bring their production units up to the high performance level of their builder's technical support folks. They are awesome!
 
I wonder... is there anything in the finish kit that could be scratch built so you could keep making some progress?

yeah that seems ridiculous for a company to have that sort of backlog. I know there's probably more to it, but Why don't they buy another machine already!?! Seems to me the only reason to not throw money at the problem might be if you think the demand is temporary.
 
Meanwhile our deposits languish in Van’s bank account. I do hope the despondency being shown here doesn’t come back to bite Aurora on the arse…
 
I think the doors and glass are in the finish kit? Those items would give builders a big chunk of work if they were sent with the fuse, or just sent to builders who needed the parts to keep working.

(Edit - Correction, I didn't realize this was a -12 thread when I posted. I'm building a -10 and finish kits are also 16-18 months..)
 
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I think the doors and glass are in the finish kit? Those items would give builders a big chunk of work if they were sent with the fuse, or just sent to builders who needed the parts to keep working.
RV-12 doesn't have doors.... at least mine doesn't.....
 
I’ve been reading these posts for a long time, and fortunately they don’t affect me because with my latest build - I bought a used kit that was mostly complete - didn’t involve as much kit component parts. I’ve built 4 of these RV kits and mostly didn’t have to deal with these unusually long delays. What bothers me is that the quality of this company seems to be ‘tarnished’. I never had to deal with these kind of delays with the kits I’ve built before. I spoke with Abby from Flightline Interiors yesterday and she said she is not accepting orders for her interior parts until she hires enough qualified people for her to meet demand. She said her orders were approaching a year out, and that is ridiculous, and she didn’t want to run her business that way. One of the things I wanted from her was her aileron control tube boots, and she has them in stock. Anyway, I commend her for having a business standard that doesn’t keep her customers waiting for something that they may need much sooner.
I don’t understand why Vans Aircraft doesn’t just stop accepting orders for new kits and subkits until they can get this under control. They are sacrificing their excellent reputation as a kit supplier with delivery dates they know they can’t possibly comply with, evidenced by their track record over the past year or so. The reputation of Vans Aircraft has been the best of any kit aircraft company for a long time, and that’s one reason why many of us chose to go with this kit decision. They are burning that loyalty that has been created over the last decades with quality parts and honesty with their business.
I ordered some subkits for my RV6 last year in February. Part of the order was my baffle kit. There were two parts on the baffle kit that was on back order, but they sent me the rest of the kit (plus an exhaust system and other parts on the order). Well, in May I called Vans and asked about the remaining baffle kit parts delivery status and they said they were still looking for some vender to supply these parts, and that they estimated it would be at least three months later. I told them to cancel the back order, and that I would just make the parts myself. These were parts that are flat aluminum that I made myself in maybe 1hour, and that they should have been able to pop out of a CNC machine at 1,000 an hour. Anyway, I canceled the back order. I’ve done that twice over the last six months, but the order is still open. The total order was over $2000, less the non-delivered BO parts, and it is still open….. 9 months later.
Don’t get me wrong. I think Vans Aircraft has the best series of EAB aircraft there is. I just think they have lost it when it comes to supplying kits in the way the company was created. I have many local friends that have ordered parts, been given delivery dates, and have not gotten them - months later. One of my local friends, 5 time RV builder, ordered parts for an RV7 aileron last winter. He was told to expect delivery in May. No word from Vans, nothing, even with inquiries, so he built the part himself, and finished the aileron for the customer. He just finally received the aileron rib part from Vans yesterday. No explanation about the delay - nothing. This is not an isolated story. I hope they can get their delivery problems straightened out, because this company is the lifeblood of GA in my opinion.
 
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Meanwhile our deposits languish in Van’s bank account. I do hope the despondency being shown here doesn’t come back to bite Aurora on the arse…
I was told by Van's that the 25% deposit is used as operating cash flow... I really didn't like that answer given the lead times.
 
I was told by Van's that the 25% deposit is used as operating cash flow... I really didn't like that answer given the lead times.

Seems pretty reasonable I think - some of Van's suppliers are not huge multinationals that can afford to float months of stock before they get paid. This money has to come from somewhere.

Imagine the other way - 100 finish kits on order, COGS is $10k each, Van's needs to pay for all these parts while they pull together all the components and package them into your finishing kit. That's a cool million they need to pay out while waiting for all the parts to come together. Van's is doing well, but that's a lot of money out. And the number might be higher than 100.

Another option is that they can borrow money to pay these suppliers, and increase kit prices to cover these costs - which just make some lucky financial institution richer using your money.

Since you are going to pay the money anyway, and what interest rate would you get from your bank if the money stayed there? Probably less than the increase due to borrowing money.
 
I was told by Van's that the 25% deposit is used as operating cash flow... I really didn't like that answer given the lead times.

Why do you need cash when your supplier won't ship you a part for 16 months and won't receive an invoice for it until a month after that. Makes sense if they wait until 3 months before anticipated ship date before collecting it though. Understandable for parts they make, but I sure hope it is not taking them 16 months to make a part once they paid for raw materials; Likely all supplier issues.

I do understand taking a deposit to hold a slot for you though. Given the expansion necessary to meet the current demand, that seems fair.

Larry
 
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Seems pretty reasonable I think - some of Van's suppliers are not huge multinationals that can afford to float months of stock before they get paid. This money has to come from somewhere.

Imagine the other way - 100 finish kits on order, COGS is $10k each, Van's needs to pay for all these parts while they pull together all the components and package them into your finishing kit. That's a cool million they need to pay out while waiting for all the parts to come together. Van's is doing well, but that's a lot of money out. And the number might be higher than 100.

Another option is that they can borrow money to pay these suppliers, and increase kit prices to cover these costs - which just make some lucky financial institution richer using your money.

Since you are going to pay the money anyway, and what interest rate would you get from your bank if the money stayed there? Probably less than the increase due to borrowing money.

Given that nobody can seem to get anything from Vans in less than 6 months, it seems unlikely to me that they are sitting on parts for 16 months to ship your complete order. If they are, they need to hire a financial guy. Industry kinda cracked the code on inventory management in the 80's. According to posters on this thread, even after 16 months they are seeing significant BO quantities.

Larry
 
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I don’t disagree that a deposit is sensible, but with such long lead times and the price increases on all components and fuel, who is to say that the “good times” that Van’s experienced over the last two years don’t very quickly change for the worse and people stop building? It wouldn’t take long before a lack of income stream means our deposits are at risk.

Irrespective of the deposits, I feel your pain. I’m awaiting a 7 finish kit and I’ve only been waiting 9 months… waiting is boring!
 
I waited 23 months for an RV-6 finish kit, received with numerous backorders. After a conversation with Greg at Sun n Fun all I got were excuses, Its time for Vans to stop the excuses and start solving the problem. Every problem has a solution and excuses are not the answer. If the management at Vans can't solve this issue, perhaps someone else can.
I have been a loyal Vans customer, having built several airplanes, bought, sold, enjoyed many more.
 
I’ve been reading these posts for a long time, and fortunately they don’t affect me because with my latest build - I bought a used kit that was mostly complete - didn’t involve as much kit component parts. I’ve built 4 of these RV kits and mostly didn’t have to deal with these unusually long delays. What bothers me is that the quality of this company seems to be ‘tarnished’. I never had to deal with these kind of delays with the kits I’ve built before. I spoke with Abby from Flightline Interiors yesterday and she said she is not accepting orders for her interior parts until she hires enough qualified people for her to meet demand. She said her orders were approaching a year out, and that is ridiculous, and she didn’t want to run her business that way. One of the things I wanted from her was her aileron control tube boots, and she has them in stock. Anyway, I commend her for having a business standard that doesn’t keep her customers waiting for something that they may need much sooner.

The original builder of my airplane used Flightline Interiors 10 years ago. When I bought it, I noted that the quality of the leather seating was excellent but I never cared for the seat style and the foam was at EOL. I called Abby in early May of 2021 about new seats and she was very helpful but very clear that she had a 10 month backlog. She was very apologetic. I didn't have a pressing need so I went ahead. The seats and carpet that she built for me were excellent, and delivered exactly when she had predicted. Interesting to note that the backlog problem has been getting so much worse. I was frustrated with the seats and I'm sure the delays would be far worse if I was building an airplane, but given how little I know about the manufacturing process, I certainly don't blame Abby, nor could I entirely blame Van's, for the delays.
 
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Seems pretty reasonable I think - some of Van's suppliers are not huge multinationals that can afford to float months of stock before they get paid. This money has to come from somewhere.

Imagine the other way - 100 finish kits on order, COGS is $10k each, Van's needs to pay for all these parts while they pull together all the components and package them into your finishing kit. That's a cool million they need to pay out while waiting for all the parts to come together. Van's is doing well, but that's a lot of money out. And the number might be higher than 100.

Another option is that they can borrow money to pay these suppliers, and increase kit prices to cover these costs - which just make some lucky financial institution richer using your money.

Since you are going to pay the money anyway, and what interest rate would you get from your bank if the money stayed there? Probably less than the increase due to borrowing money.
I have no issue giving them cash, even the full amount, if the wait time were reasonable. I think holding the spot in line, prior to any work being done on the kit should be a $500 deposit max for the sub kits.
 
Just a data point

I royally F'up the canopy on my RV8 while prepping it for paint. I have to order a new expensive plexiglass canopy and it needs to be crated and freighted almost across the county. From the time of the call to place the order to the time the XPO freight truck arrived at my house, it took less than 14 days. Wow. This is the kind of service I used to get from Van's and continue to get. If Vans got it in stock, it will get shipped.
 
The fuse is mostly done but, hit a brick wall today when after assembling the main gear legs it was discovered that the brackets needed to secure them to the fuse are missing. The finish kit is the only kit on my list with B-O parts. Can't fit the wings to the fuse until the landing gear is on, can't hang the tail cone/emp or the engine either!

My avionics kit showed up first but it was complete... don't need it until last but at least it was all there.

So close yet so far!
 
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