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Canopy Latch Question...

Piper J3

Well Known Member
I have seen a picture of a RV-12 canopy latch handle where the strike plate ends up between the loops of the handle. On my 12 (SN 120058) the handle has a tab on one end and this is what engages with the strike plate. I’m wondering if there was a design change somewhere along the way. Sorry for lengthy (poor) description. I wish VAF allowed easy file attachments so I could just show a pic. Thanks in advance...

I believe the photo below is the new design with striker plate between loops of the handle.

open
 
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I have an SLSA RV12 bought from Van's. I didn't notice how the handle was used in the latch.....tab or inside the handle loop...I only knew it was closed and the green light was on. Then the light went out in flight...canopy didn't come open. I messed around with it on the ground and now I see that the latch will only be secure when the closure is inside the loop....at least on my bird.

It takes a little muscle to get it closed however.

EBB
 
Suggest you use TinyPic.com and post the image on VAF directly

Here from TinyPic...
kbuovo.jpg


Thanks I learned something new today with TinyPic. Anyway, as you can see in the pic... the strike plate is within the handle loop. On my plane the extension tab only engages the strike plate. The extension tab is at the end of the handle loop. I will use drawings mentioned by Mitch757 for Default Canopy Latch - Check Vans Notification 14-05-22. I'll try to sort this out as soon as weather permits. Thanks for all the help. VAF is great...
 
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What is the issue?

From the looks of it, this is how its supposed to work. With the strike plate inside the hoop, closing the canopy up does pull the canopy and the roll bar together nice and snug. If it were on the outside of the hoop, it would be pushing them apart. I can't tell for sure, but it appears you used the standard LP-3/4 rivets to attach the UHMW strike plate (on the hook)--I believe it should be countersunk such that the hoop, when running over that UHMW plate, doesn't have to go over and LP-4-type rivet heads.

Thinking a bit more about it--the two rivets shown are just fine as LP rivets--I believe there is a third rivet which is countersunk hidden where the loop makes contact with it.
 
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Just to clarify...The pic above is not my plane. Mine has the striker plate on the outside of the handle loop. I don't have a picture of my latch. Something's not right with my setup. It works fine and it appears safe but apparently something is amiss. I'll report back when weather permits and also provide photo.
 
From what I have read, it would appear that someone building yours drilled the hole in the canopy in the wrong place!
 
From what I have read, it would appear that someone building yours drilled the hole in the canopy in the wrong place!

I have all the drawings, manuals, etc. from the original builder and so I will check dimensions when weather permits. Based on what I find I'll make a decision on how to proceed.
 
That "gizmo" appears to be the eyeball floodlight for the instrument panel that is part of Van's lighting kit.
 
Before anyone else asks J3 about the machine in the posted picture - he's already said, that isn't his 12!
 
The forum is kind of dead tonight so I’ll digress a little…

Right, that’s not my 12 in the pic. I bought mine from the original builder and I knew it had some deficiencies. IAS reading high – sent back to Dynon for repair, stall warning inop – bad contact at wing root, small fuel leak in tank – tightened sender access panel screws, fuel pressure alarms – cleaned contacts on sender unit, dead battery in ELT remote switch, and both fuel tank and landing gear SB’s not complied with – to be completed this summer.

I bought the plane this past October with 50TT and now have 76 hours on the Hobbs. This is a wonderful airplane to fly. Control harmony, cruise speed, rate of climb, ease of engine management, ergonomics, unrestricted visibility, safety, ease of maintenance, easy ingress, economical to operate, just a real pleasure to own and operate. Did I mention it has real cabin heat?

This summer I will attend AirVenture for my fourth time. I’m signed up for the LSA Repairman Inspection Aircraft Course to be given the two days after the close of events. This will enable me to conduct my own annual condition inspections. I’m really looking forward to this interesting and rewarding experience.

I’m a 62 YO retired mechanical engineer. I got my pilot license in 1970 in an Aeronca Chief 11AC. I have owned a ’46 Cub for the past 23 years and traded it for the 12. I have about 1100 flying hours total. I thought I’d miss the Cub but the smile I get when flying the 12 erases any sentimental value I had for the old machine. I operated the Cub as Light Sport Pilot and will continue same with the 12.

In closing I’d like to thank everyone on the forum for their help and understanding each time I have asked questions in order to gain more insight into the workings of the RV-12. I’m sure there is much more to learn.

If you’re bored, here’s what else I do that’s aviation related http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=237058

A few pics of the old mount and the new bird…
..
2dtsnqh.jpg

2ylqjgg.jpg


30s7yif.jpg


2rh8arn.jpg
 
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Here from TinyPic...
kbuovo.jpg


Thanks I learned something new today with TinyPic. Anyway, as you can see in the pic... the strike plate is within the handle loop. On my plane the extension tab only engages the strike plate. The extension tab is at the end of the handle loop. I will use drawings mentioned by Mitch757 for Default Canopy Latch - Check Vans Notification 14-05-22. I'll try to sort this out as soon as weather permits. Thanks for all the help. VAF is great...

The photo is correct and the rivets are correct. There is one left most rivet that is a counter sunk per the latest rev that calls out the canopy switch.
 
Canary latch

Just to clarify...The pic above is not my plane. Mine has the striker plate on the outside of the handle loop. I don't have a picture of my latch. Something's not right with my setup. It works fine and it appears safe but apparently something is amiss. I'll report back when weather permits and also provide photo.

Just checked mine and the tab is what catches the hooked plate and plastic latch. The hole in the canopy was already pre-drilled When it arrived from Van's. I'm not sure how , following the directions - the latch could be moved back to be in the middle of the handle.
 
Just checked mine and the tab is what catches the hooked plate and plastic latch. The hole in the canopy was already pre-drilled When it arrived from Van's. I'm not sure how , following the directions - the latch could be moved back to be in the middle of the handle.

If I am correctly understanding your description, your handle is not latching properly and should be corrected.
This previously posted photo shows how the handle latch interface should look when it is latching properly.

kbuovo.jpg
 
My guess is that the latch plate is riveted in the wrong location on the roll bar. That is the only way that I can see that would allow the tab on the handle to contact the plate.
 
But what I want to know is who crawled into the baggage compartment on short final to take that photo?
The more I study this and compare to mine, the more perplexed I become. This is like a riddle or something.

If I am correctly understanding your description, your handle is not latching properly and should be corrected.
This previously posted photo shows how the handle latch interface should look when it is latching properly.

kbuovo.jpg
 
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Hi all,
I’ve had a rv8 for years and in the last couple weeks purchased a 12 with less than 100 hrs. I flew it many times with the canopy latch not fully engaged, not realizing it needed to go over the nylon latch. When closed, it looks just like the picture shown. It takes considerable effort to get it closed correctly, and even more, unreasonable amount, to get it back out of the nylon piece to open. It takes both hands to unlatch. My question, is this right and how or what can be done to loosen up or make this easier? The canopy latched is one safety issue, but getting out could be another. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks
 
Check under the nylon latch block for shim plates. If there are shim plates, remove them one at a time to reduce the latching force.
 
Thanks for that Bob. I’m not at the airplane right now but I’ll check it. I don’t recall seeing any but that makes a lot of sense since the pressure on the block is just too great. If the through rod where just a 1/8 in. longer also. No adjustment there I don’t believe. Even if there were not any shims, I suppose I could just shave a bit off the bottom of the block also. Thanks again.
Norm
 
As mentioned, if the block is shimmed too much below the roll bar it will make it difficult to latch / unlatch.

If that is not the cause, the unlatching resistance can be adjusted if needed, by adding a slight bevel to the step in the block by trimming the sharp edge using a razor blade.

Do a very small amount at a time. When properly adjusted, you should be able to open it with one hand but it should still have some resistance that you have to overcome to rotate the handle past the step.
 
Another good idea. Thanks for that Scott. You’re right, I’d like some resistance. That’s the idea of knowing it’s shut, but I’ll try both of these suggestions. This puts me on the right track. Thanks
 
Another variable is whether or not the original builder (or subsequent owners) applied non-OEM weather-stripping between the canopy's aft undersurface and the corresponding mating surface of the rollbar. Such added weather-stripping may cause the stock latch to be difficult to engage/disengage. It is not difficult to adjust the latch to compensate for this added thickness of weather-stripping.
 
Thanks David. I assume what you mean by adjusting the latch you mean one or both of the previous suggestions, reduce shims or shave the nylon latch plate?
 
Yes -- IMHO adjusting the shim is preferred. If you choose to shave the nylon plate be sure that sufficient material remains to adequately capture and retain the metal latch arm. On my RV-12 I find that pulling down on the latch handle while turning it helps to slide the metal arm up the nylon slope into the latched detent position.
 
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Yes -- IMHO adjusting the shim is preferred. If you choose to shave the nylon plate be sure that sufficient material remains to adequately capture and retain the metal latch arm. On my RV-12 I find that pulling down on the latch handle while turning it helps to slide the metal arm up the nylon slope into the latched detent position.

Just to clarify....
My recommendation isn't to shave the block thinner at the detente step. It is to use a blade and cut a 45 degree bevel so that the edge of the step isn't so sharp.
The reason the handle can be hard to open is because the sharp edge of the handle gets caught on the sharp corner of the step. If you relieve the sharpness of the step slightly it can have a major influence on how difficult it is to open.

A better idea is to upgrade to the new handle / latch design
 
Thanks again Scott. I understand what you’re saying about the sharp edge because, as you suggest, that is the problem. Also I’d like to learn more about the new handle/latch design and how easy it would be to change. So far, I haven’t been able to find any closeups to see exactly how it’s different. I wonder if others have any experience in making that change.
Norm
 
The new canopy latch design locks the canopy in the open position so that the canopy can not open more than a few inches. Somewhere in these forums is a link to a video showing the wind catching an open canopy and slamming it against the propeller. After watching that video, you will want to order the new canopy latch.
 
The new canopy latch design locks the canopy in the open position so that the canopy can not open more than a few inches. Somewhere in these forums is a link to a video showing the wind catching an open canopy and slamming it against the propeller. After watching that video, you will want to order the new canopy latch.

The legacy latch has an add-on catch available that will prevent a propped open canopy from being blown open.

A photo of the new latch design can be viewed HERE
 
Hi all,
I?ve had a rv8 for years and in the last couple weeks purchased a 12 with less than 100 hrs. I flew it many times with the canopy latch not fully engaged, not realizing it needed to go over the nylon latch. When closed, it looks just like the picture shown. It takes considerable effort to get it closed correctly, and even more, unreasonable amount, to get it back out of the nylon piece to open. It takes both hands to unlatch. My question, is this right and how or what can be done to loosen up or make this easier? The canopy latched is one safety issue, but getting out could be another. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks

Thanks again Scott. I understand what you?re saying about the sharp edge because, as you suggest, that is the problem. Also I?d like to learn more about the new handle/latch design and how easy it would be to change. So far, I haven?t been able to find any closeups to see exactly how it?s different. I wonder if others have any experience in making that change.
Norm

As Scott and others have said, it is possible to adjust the latch you have but even after having done that mine was still too difficult to get open in a possible emergency. I used to carry a short piece of plastic pipe for leverage just in case. Since then I have installed the new latch kit and can answer your question regarding making that change on an older canopy.

First there is a distinction between the latch and the catch. Your questions are regarding the latch. The catch came later to help prevent the canopy from being blown open when the handle was unlatched and resting up on the roll bar.

This is the legacy latch and catch like you have. You might not have the catch as it came a bit later than 2013, I think.
i-PCzkkCJ-L.jpg


Here are a couple more pics of the new latch and catch. The parts to retro fit this upgrade are available as a kit from Van's for $125 and the reference is notification N17-12-08; a 14 page set of instructions to install the kit.
i-phdgq9B-L.jpg

i-SG955m2-L.jpg

To install this upgrade, I would describe the level of difficulty as at least a 7 or 8 on a scale of 10. Maybe less if you are an experienced builder with all the tools, more if you have not built anything similar.
 
As long as we're at it... Here’s a suggestion to keep the latch handle oriented in the open position when the canopy is raised/lowered. Drill a small hole and press in a nickel-plated Neodymium magnet (3/16”∅ x 3/16”) it will hold the steel handle against the stop plate. When lowering the canopy while standing outside of the airplane the handle will often rotate and strike the roll bar preventing the full canopy closure. You then have to climb up on the wing and turn the handle by hand. The magnet fixes this problem…

 
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The magnet would work but I am a little hesitant to place a magnetic source that close to the magnetometer, in case of the D-180, or the ADAHRS, in case of SV, located a few feet away in the tail cone. It might not be a problem, but the KAI instructions to simply squeeze the tube the handle turns in works well and why deviate from the plans in this regard?
I use a vise grip to do the squeeze, that way you can just barely turn the adjusting screw and do a trial squeeze without over doing it. It is easy to over squeeze and then have a problem getting the handle back in.
 
All I can say is that you all have been very generous with your advice and the pictures tell a lot. It’s true, mine doesn’t have the catch feature. And from what Tony says, even with the adjustments done on the old, it may not be enough, I’ll see. Evidently the new system really is the ultimate answer and I may end up doing that after trying the simple things first. Right now, I’m out of town, but will get on this at the end of the week. Thanks again.
 
Thank you all

Not flying yet but I appreciate the contributions that Tony and others have made to my 12 build. The pictures and descriptions are spot on. I reviewed Van's instructions to make this upgrade and decided that I would do it 'some other time'. These pictures have made it more understandable. Thanks again, Tony, and others - I appreciate.:cool:
 
I just wanted to post a quick followup regarding my extreme difficulty locking and especially unlocking my canopy on a newly purchased 2013 RV12 with about 60 hrs total time. All the excellent suggestions gave me a direction to go. The very first suggestion and the easiest to try was to remove the shims one at a time. As it turned out, there was only one, so I removed it and, bingo, it was like night and day. That was the answer. It was so easy, why had it not been done by the builder. Before, it took two hands to close with much effort, and opening was even harder to the point I thought maybe I was locked in as the sun was quickly cooking me. Now I just reach up and it easily snaps in and out with one hand. Amazing �� So thanks all, problem solved.
Norm
 
what switches to buy

I need to buy the mirco switches for the canopy handle and the wing bolts for my 12is locally. Almost every switch will do the job, but it would be nice to have the right bolt pattern. Can someone send a photo of his switches? Thanks
 
Major Tom -

Below are a couple of links to my blog that show the micro switch. As you will read I broke one by stepping on it accidentally and if memory serves me I just ordered the replacement from Mouser an electronics supplier here in the states. The micro switch is a very common design so should be easy for you to find one locally. If you click on the photos on the blog you can enlarge the pictures.

http://www.dogaviation.com/2015/05/canopy-latch-switch-one-step-forward.html

http://www.dogaviation.com/2015/05/canopy-latch-micro-switch-act-2.html

Hope that helps you,
 
Thanks to both of you. This was just the info I needed. I will see if the switches will work in a 12iS too.
 
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