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Starter issue

trackdom

Well Known Member
Hi,
I recently experienced two problems with my O 320 engine. Far from my home base, turning the key to start up, and...nothing. Solenoid is brand new, And I can hear that it works, but no starter. That happens sometimes . Battery is ok, master relay is ok , skytec starter is 3 years old, 200 hours . Today I removed the starter from the engine for a visual check, nothing special to declare. As Skytec says I ?ll do some voltage measurments between different devices to see if somewhere a voltage drop could happen. I am waiting for a booster but I am not sure to fix the problem. I would appreciate not to buy a starter every 200 hours.
Any information greatly appreciated .
Thanks
 
I'm too lazy to read through that entire thread, but the two obvious possibilities are: a high resistance somewhere in either the positive or negative power circuits to the starter (most likely suspects are the battery terminals), or, if you have the style with the solenoid (can) on the side of the starter, the high current contacts inside the solenoid could be going flaky. Used to be a common problem with solenoid-activated automotive starters (which is what the Skytec actually is).

The 1st will manifest as low (<9v) voltage on the fat terminal of the starter, or >0 volts on the starter frame, while <start> is activated.

The 2nd will manifest as normal voltage everywhere (>9V on positive terminal, <0.5V on the starter frame), referenced to the battery's actual negative post.

Last likely issue would be a dead starter.
 
Solenoid is brand new, And I can hear that it works, but no starter.

Has happened to me, it was the bendix drive in my starter. Not a skytec, but Kelly Aerospace. I would try to jump it just in case battery is weak before I would do anything more extensive. Skytec does have a good trouble shooting guide to use, but you need to have a meter and know how to operate it.
 
Has happened to me, it was the bendix drive in my starter. Not a skytec, but Kelly Aerospace. I would try to jump it just in case battery is weak before I would do anything more extensive. Skytec does have a good trouble shooting guide to use, but you need to have a meter and know how to operate it.

Right. I?ll mesure voltage on different places . I am going to put a switch between battery positive and S connection of the relay to do the contact as the key switch until it doesn?t work . If 12 v is coming to the starter , so starter I sur failing.
Is there a chance to see inside the starter and clean it up?
 
I contacted Vans , they think it?s a well known starter issue with this 149-12 LS starter. They recommend XLT version .
 
I contacted Vans , they think it’s a well known starter issue with this 149-12 LS starter. They recommend XLT version .

If Vans recommends you spend money to replace the starter, you should read the thread linked in post #2 and consider an NL starter. The NL is not a permanent magnet starter and gives your battery/wiring a bit more leeway for voltage drop. You solve two potentional issues with one purchase.
 
Hi,
I recently experienced two problems with my O 320 engine. Far from my home base, turning the key to start up, and...nothing. Solenoid is brand new, And I can hear that it works, but no starter.

I've had the same problem from the beginning with my IO-360. Especially the second or third flight of a day, I'd her a "clack" but the prop wouldn't turn.

Now here's what I found out for my setup: The starter gear moves forward but hits the ring gear from behind - so it does not properly seat into the teeth. Also, I'm using a PC545-battery and not the PC680. I think it might be the different battery that delivers a current that is just a bit weaker than that required to force the starter gear into the ring gear.

So for me, hitting the starter two or three times solves the problem. My next step in troubleshooting is to start the engine with an external battery.
 
It's buried deep in the cobwebs, but IIRC, there's a spec on pinion clearance to the ring gear teeth, modified with shim under starter mount. If the teeth aren't meshing consistently, that's worth a look. Check several spots around the ring gear.

edit: The current required to activate the pinion solenoid is well under 15A (plus the initial spike), so even a smaller battery shouldn't have a problem supplying the grunt to move the pinion.

Ignore the above if the starter has a true bendix (spiral mechanical advance for the pinion).
 
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I have a LS , so solenoid , is there a way to fix the problem , something to clean?

Just read my link. Replace the solenoid! It's a $20 part and you can replace it while the starter is still bolted to the engine. I've had to replace 3 of them in 11 years. I think what happens is dust gets in between the plunger and housing and binds it up. Recently here, someone posted a pic of the pinion gear jammed forward. That would be from the solenoid too.
 
+1 on replace solenoid

I have an LS on my engine and it's gone bad 2x in about 150 hrs unfortunately. Replace the solenoid, its not too difficult to do in about 15 minutes if you can access the back of it. Just make sure your replacement solenoid wire posts are the same. The last one I bought they were reversed, no big deal, just reverse the wire connection.

In a pinch try moving the prop just a small amount and try starting, it may catch. I was able to do that on a cross country where the solenoid started acting up, but I could still hear it tapping the back of the ring gear. It doesn't always work. Replaced it when I got home. Next cross country I think I'll carry a spare.

hgerdhardt - did you ever get to try a rubber booted one, any better luck with dust prevention?

Gregg
 
............hgerdhardt - did you ever get to try a rubber booted one, any better luck with dust prevention?

Gregg

No, I never did. I bought one from ebay in which the photo had a boot but when it was delivered, it didn't have one. That one has actually been working fine for several years now. (as he knocks on wood)

One of mine failed in Death Valley, at Furnace Creek. I got it going by using one of the cowl hinge pins to pry out the pinion manually into the ring gear and then it worked enough to start the engine. It was only a week old after SkyTec had just overhauled it. That incident is what prompted me to figure these things out!
 
No, I never did. I bought one from ebay in which the photo had a boot but when it was delivered, it didn't have one. That one has actually been working fine for several years now. (as he knocks on wood)

One of mine failed in Death Valley, at Furnace Creek. I got it going by using one of the cowl hinge pins to pry out the pinion manually into the ring gear and then it worked enough to start the engine. It was only a week old after SkyTec had just overhauled it. That incident is what prompted me to figure these things out!

You might want to reconsider if you're ever in that position again. If it's stuck retracted, and it will stick extended, what's to prevent it from *staying* extended after engine start? If it does, it'll be turning WAY faster than design. Maybe fast enough generate concern about shrapnel.
 
You might want to reconsider if you're ever in that position again. If it's stuck retracted, and it will stick extended, what's to prevent it from *staying* extended after engine start? If it does, it'll be turning WAY faster than design. Maybe fast enough generate concern about shrapnel.

Yup, you bring up a good point that I should have pointed out. When I did that "pinion extraction" by force, I started the engine with the cowl off, ran it for a minute, shut it down and inspected it. Started two more times and did the same thing. Each time, pinion retracted normally. Cowled up, started the engine, listened without headphones, all sounded fine, so we took off.

And that also reminds me of something that I do as a habit at every startup. I ALWAYS start the engine with headphones off so that I can hear the engine as clearly as possible. If the engine has some sort of mechanical problem, it will most likely be most clearly noticeable immediately during/after startup. If you do this religiously, you will have a pretty good "ear" for the engine and will know if something is off.
 
Starter unmounted

Now my starter is on the table, I cleaned it but was not so dirty. The problem is to remount it . I have no exploded view to help. It ?s rather simple inside , but unable to do the right job.
 
New starter

I decided to order a new starter. It?s a 149-12-xlt, from Vans store. Hope problem will be solved .
 
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