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Duck Strike

N111BN

Member
I was flying this morning North East of San Francisco when I had a bird strike - or to be more acurate a Duck strike. It happened in slow motion - I remember watching it look at me and turn to avoid me, I did the same but it didn't work out. I had a new GoPro video camera mounted on the wing, shooting at 120 frames per second (to give slow motion video). From the video it looks like the duck goes through the propellor arc, but misses the blades.
When I got back to CCR I told the tower I had a bird strike even though the airplane was flying fine. The thud of the bird sounded like it came from the back so I was worried about tail or landing gear damage. The fire truck rolled, the FAA and NTSB called - now I am filling out paper work!!


http://vimeo.com/31314603


Stay safe - especially if flying low down with the birds and ducks!!
 
Not that is makes any difference, but judging from he video I think it is a hawk you hit.

Either way, glad you are okay.
 
Makes you wanna declare WAR in ducks AND hawks because of all the trouble! Might even throw pigeons into the mix for good measure.
 
thanks

Thanks all. It might be a hawk - I thought I saw web feet on the video though. I might send the feathers and blood to the FAA - they will identify the bird for you.
 
maybe a hawk

Nice reflexes, that could have been nasty for both of you. Nice video, too.

Good enough video that I think you can identify the species and the sex. Looks like a male Northern Harrier (the military Harrier borrowed its name because they both can hover). Used to be called a Marsh Hawk, so you were over the right habitat.

At :15 as it begins to roll away from you, you can see it has a white belly and underwings, with dark wingtips. Like this: http://shuttersalt.com/sites/default/files/images/northern-harrier-1804.jpg

And at :30 just before it passes your prop you can see its back, with a white rump patch, like this: http://ridgefieldbirds.com/Images08Feb/RNWR_northern_harrier_in_flight_02-03-08.jpg

They are great graceful flyers, spending a lot of time flying low and slow just over the marsh, hunting for anything from mice to ducks. Males weigh around 3/4 pound, or a third as much as a mallard. They will soar up higher sometimes for a wider view; that didn't work out too well this time.
 
Yesterday I glanced down to check engine temps and such. My wife called "Bird" and I looked up just in time to see and eagle go over my right wingtip at about 15' above me. We were at 3500' at low cruise (about 150 mph.) I don't care how majestic eagles are--it almost scared the **** out of me. Glad you didn't take the duck in the windscreen.

Bob
 
Thanks all. It might be a hawk - I thought I saw web feet on the video though. I might send the feathers and blood to the FAA - they will identify the bird for you.

I'm just glad you are okay.

Being a student of birds (birds lit the "spark" for me) i was watching the way the bird's wings folded and how he reacted to change his flight. Ducks don't do that, only birds of prey.

What is the plan of attack for repairs?

BTW, that was good thinking to get the emergency response guys rolling. They don't mind, and you could have had damage that would have caused a dad landing or had a fuel fuel leak from the bird strike. Good thinking in a pressure situation.
 
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Probably a good thing it wasn't a duck, or you might have lost the landing gear. One of the guys on my airport hit a duck at the wing root of a Debonair (obviously much slower) & it put a ~5" deep dent in the leading edge D-cell of the wing.

Charlie
 
Reaction time

Looking at the end of the video it appears the airplane pitches up after the bird goes by. Maybe a reaction time delay. I wish there was a way we could determine if painted strips on spinners will help. I had a close call with an eagle and have since painted a strip on the spinner.
 
Now you know why they say---look out---duck!! Thankfully minimal damage, a little duck tape will fix it.
 
Hawk Attack

Your ground shadow shows you had the sun very much at your back. That is a great tactic for sneaking up on hawks.
 
Glad you got away relatively unscathed. Having just recently gone through this scenario myself, I can appreciate more than most just how lucky you were (yes, I said 'lucky").

This just serves as another reminder that birdstrikes are a reality - a point I hoped to make before "my" thread on the same subject was shut down. Most "fast" aircraft are designed to survive birdstrikes because it really is not practical to rely on "see and avoid" alone. Airliners and fighters have some degree of built in protection, but we sure don't. I've been hit by birds at 7500 feet, in the pattern, and most recently, right on the deck. If we continue to fly, we will continue to hit birds.

Odds are, most of you will never take a bird through the windshield like I did, but that doesn't mean you have much choice in the matter either.

Better be ready.
 
Hi Michael,
Yes I was very lucky. Just looked at you pictures and you were as well - and you had it far worse, glad you are OK. If the hawk had come through my windshield I can't imaging what would have happened. Almost made me want to go and buy a helmet and visor - but doubt if I will.
I felt quite sick this morning - not sure if it was a delayed reaction or from the Peaking Duck I ate last night :)
 
Wonder if it is the same one we flew fight past near Sunol on our way to KHAF on Friday?
We were at about 2500'...
 
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Helmets...

I know it is an unpopular topic for many, but this is a big reason I advocate helmets. Being a helicopter guy, flying 90% of my time 80-120 kts below 1000 ft, I have seen many near misses. We tend to average about one strike every 2 weeks (although we fly a combined 480 hrs a day here!). Maybe one per 6 months or so comes through the window.

Visors can save eyes, helmets save head bonks, they hold your ear cups and mic very stable in high maneuvering, etc. They are hot sometimes, but a very good insurance policy!
 
What paperwork?

You're the first person I've ever heard of who had to fill out paperwork after an emergency was declared, and this includes several hundred CFIs at refresher clinics.

So what paperwork did they give you?

thanks

Ed
 
Paperwork

Here's the scoop on the paperwork. Coming back to CCR I called the tower and informed them I needed a straight in landing due to a bird strike. They asked the normal soles and fuel on board question. I was about 10 miles out. They got the equipement rolling. I didn't declare and emergency - the controller did that, which was OK by me. Note: I should have asked for a no delay landing as they ended up giving me the straight in runway but it was downwind, It was about a 5kt tailwind so I elected to use it. It did add confusion to me when I did not need it as I worked out the tailwind decision.
After I landed the crash truck followed me to my hangar. The rescue guy and I looked at the damage and then he said he had to call the NTSB - which he did. He asked me for my drivers and pilot licenses (he was not a law enforcement officer - just an airport employee). I gave it to him - he was there to help me so I didn't want to argue the point. After talking to my buddies I started to open the hangar to push the airplane back in. I was told I was not allowed to move it until the NTSB had released it! I asked how long that would be and was told they might want to look at it but they probably will release it on the phone. This they did about 10 or 15 minutes later.
Later that day I received an email with an FAA form to fill out from the airport management.

http://wildlife-mitigation.tc.faa.gov/wildlife/strikenew.aspx

I filed it out as it 'seems' innocent enough - and we trust our elected officials right!!!!

The tower also called me as I was driving home and just asked a couple of questions for their report - like the location of the strike.

So that's the story on the paper work
 
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That form looks similar to the one that was filled out a year or so ago after I had a probable bird strike at work (737) at nearby (to KCCR) Sacramento (KSMF).

In the flare, a Crane or Heron (BIG bird) appeared from the right, crossed our path, and went right above my forward window. No thump, but on taxi in, we reported a possible bird strike (just in case it was now a FOD hazard in the touchdown zone). No blood on the jet, but a white spot on the forward fuselage just above the left eyebrow window made it look like it may have just skipped off. No carcass was found either, but the airport police came to the jetway to fill out that form.

The airport police involvement was surprising at first, but they explained that they were just the local agency assigned to collect the data on wildlife strikes. No emergency was declared by us or the tower, so NTSB was not involved that night, and after the required maintenance inspection, we pressed on. Nothing heard since.

You may have had more phone calls and questions due to the emergency declaration, but the form seems to be the wildlife variety (no big deal, just an event tracker), not the "post emergency declaration report to the administrator" variety. You probably would have received a request for that right away if they wanted such a report.

By the way, that was amazing that you caught it all on video. Nice job flying and maintaining a cool head afterwards!

Best,
Bob
 
Interesting notice at the bottom of the form...

"The information collected is voluntary"

I guess if you were flying low in a wildlife area you could refuse...:rolleyes:
 
Prop Arc

Comments about birds going through the prop arc made me wonder, what is the probability that you actually hit a bird with a spinning prop?

I assumed the plane was travelling at 150 mph, 2700 rpm, with a two bladed prop. If the prop is 4" thick (a guess between a root that is more than that, and the tip that is MUCH less) and the bird is 12" in any dimension, then you have a 54% probability of hitting a bird that goes right through the prop. A little better than a coin flip.

Interestingly, if you have a 3 blade, your chances of hitting the bird go up to 81%.
 
I was ferrying this past Saturday a Green Spam Can CE172SP (thank God for 21Kts Tail winds) from IDP(Independence, KS) to CAE (Columbia Metro, SC) While on the RH Downwind leg and at Pattern Altitude at MKL (Jackson TN), a hughe buzzard appeared out of nowhere right over my flight path. While reacting and preparing for my turn away, the bird decided to clip its wings and dove in front of me all with less than 10 ft before impact. The bird did the most beautiful Snap Roll I've ever seen and kept on diving out of sight.

I was left wondering if the bird was a reincarnated aviator just "showing off" his new skills!
 
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Interestingly, if you have a 3 blade, your chances of hitting the bird go up to 81%.

But, you have a smaller prop arc, so the overall chance of the strike should go down somewhat because of that. Interesting calculation, though. Did you account for the difference between ideal and real forward motion?

cheers,
greg
 
Wonder if that's the first bird strike caught on camera, from an own ship video system. You may be famous! Sorry 'bout the damage though.
 
But, you have a smaller prop arc, so the overall chance of the strike should go down somewhat because of that. Interesting calculation, though. Did you account for the difference between ideal and real forward motion?

With a fixed RPM & airspeed, I didn't feel the need to account for ideal forward motion on the prop. If anything, the fact that the blade is "slipping" increases your chances of hitting the bird in a given volume of air. Since the exercise was "if the bird goes through the prop arc" then the diameter is not a factor. You are correct, though, you have a somewhat smaller chance of hitting a bird with a three blade due to smaller diameter, but it does nothing for the 50% increase in probability due to the extra blade.

The calculation was a very simple for a given blade, what fraction of the forward motion is that blade in a given position. Then calculate the bird dimensions and report the result as a percentage of the advance length.
 
Wonder if that's the first bird strike caught on camera, from an own ship video system. You may be famous! Sorry 'bout the damage though.

Discovery's "Flying Wild Alaska" had one a while back: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lskmumXNHdg

Had a too-close encounter with what looked to be a Bald Eagle over Central Florida a while back, been meaning to paint 1/3 of my white spinner red ever since. I think the jury's still out on whether it works... but I'm sure it can't hurt.

-jon
 
Wig-wag?

Nigel, I'm curious to know whether you were running wig-wag lights at the time of your bird-strike.

I've been flying with a wig-wag for the last three years. It might be my imagination but it seems that I've had fewer close calls with birds since then. My theory is that the flashing lights get the bird's attention quicker and give them more information about the plane's speed and course; similar to the spinner paint theory.
 
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CCR's firefighter blew it way out of proportion

You're the first person I've ever heard of who had to fill out paperwork after an emergency was declared, and this includes several hundred CFIs at refresher clinics.

So what paperwork did they give you?

thanks

Ed



I wondered the same thing when I first read this.

Sounds like the guy at CCR needs to lighten up and get some retraining on just when the NTSB needs to be called in. Usually when we get a bird strike call we just follow the plane to the gate or hangar, make sure everything is OK and then, possibly, take a photo and say "Have a nice day." We usually don't even ask your name, just take your N-number and write our run report.

RVMills:

Picking nits here, sorry:

As an ARFF and formerly Operations guy at SMF for 23 years I can best guess that you dealt with the USDA Wildlife folks or Airport Operations (who don't dress like cops) and not the "airport police." The Sheriff does the law enforcement at SMF and I am pretty sure (I would bet money on it) they wouldn't offer a birdstrike form. I, on the otherhand, have done that plenty of times. When we had combined ARFF and Operations jobs it used to be part of my job. And yes, our uniforms look like a cop. And when a pilot didn't want to fill one out, then I would do it for them. What year was your strike?

We have many bird strikes at my airport. I can't tell you how many times I have done runway sweeps looking for dead birds that were, or usually not, there. It seems almost daily during the fog season.

N111BN:
You might want to have a talk with CCR's management if you really felt inconvenienced.
 
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responses

Propeller hits. 99% of people are probably better at physics than me, but I actually think that the forward movement of the blades is very important and the number of blades actually is not relevant. This is based on the idea that only one blade is in a given plane as the propeller moves forward, and the blade has to be on the same as the bird to hit it. That assumes a very small bird though. And again is just based on how I visualize a propeller screwing itself forward.

Videos - there are a couple of videos on youtube. None shot at 120fps though. I might send it to the Smithsonian Inst who conduct research on bird strikes.

FAA, NTSB.
I was not inconvenienced by the guys at CCR. I am glad they are there. They pulled a passenger from a burning Malibu a few years back that crash fairly near my hangar. They have much respect from me. The FSDO called me today but I did not get a chance to speak to them. They want a statement!!

Other bird strikes - it is sobering to read about everyone else's bird strikes - I seems to be far more common that I would have thought. I am going to give them a very wide berth when I can.

I was just running with whellan stobes.
A few year back I had a Scottish Aviation Bulldog that was a ex-RAF training aircraft. The RAF in England do much of their training low level. The prop blades were painted with black and white stripes and the spinner was half white and half black. I don't recall any birds coming my way in the 200 hours I flew it, so maybe it does work.
Me and my sister at HAF in the Bulldog
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Scottish-Aviation-Bulldog/0632770/&sid=5c31561214e8c0bb13e77bda64b27b4e
 
High intensity LEDs

They didn't help me much, FWIW.

I wonder if high intensity LEDs wigwag would be better. I think that cop cars use them now (maybe some one knows for sure). The brightness of cop cars new flashing lights makes it impossible to ignore them. Our conventional strobes in day light are pretty pathetic compared to what the cops have now. I just bought some HiLEDs to play with maybe this will be be a good project.
They must hit the LEDs with high currents ( way over spec) for very short times like less than a millisecond. Anyone know?
 
Part of the probelm

Our airplanes are so quiet, from the front, I think that we tend to sneak up on them. The turbines, especially so. When one comes flying over my hangar, I can hear the "whoosh" of air going over the airplane way before I hear the engine sound.

An under-cowl air horn maybe?

?????????/
 
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