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RVer wins AOPA sweepstakes plane

LettersFromFlyoverCountry

Well Known Member
steve_lagergren.jpg

We had the honor today of being co-conspirators in the ruse by which we were able to get RV-7 builder/pilot Steve Lagergren of Litchfield, MN., into the air, where we could capture the moment when the AOPA Debonair pulled up alongside.

AOPA has the story of the win.

I'll have the behind-the-scenes deets on how we pulled it off and an inside-the-cockpit video on the blog within a few hours.

Super nice guy.

EDIT: RVers in on the escapade were Brad Benson (and son), Vince Bastiani, Michelle and Bryan Flood, Mike Hilger, Warren Starkebaum, and Jim Weckman.
 
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Wonderful.

Feel good story of the day! Thanks for sharing, Bob!

Congratulations Steve!!!!!!
 
Great job on coordinating the plan Bob - you came up with a great plan and rolled with the changes as they happened. Thanks for inviting me to be part of it!
 
Outstanding!

Congratulations! Is it one of those "too soon" moments to predict that the sweepstakes plane will be sold to fund another RV build? :p

Just kidding... Just kidding...
 
I think he's going to keep it; it fits his mission perfectly.

When his daughter was young, she had a seat in the baggage area. But she grew and so the family bought a Cardinal (might've been with a flying club; I'm not sure).

He also has wanted to finish up his instrument ticket.

I think the Cardinal is probably history.
 
Cardinal

I think he's going to keep it; it fits his mission perfectly.

When his daughter was young, she had a seat in the baggage area. But she grew and so the family bought a Cardinal (might've been with a flying club; I'm not sure).

He also has wanted to finish up his instrument ticket.

I think the Cardinal is probably history.

I know someone looking for a Cardinal. Tell him to let me know, if he plans to sell.
 
Oh geez... the video was priceless. Sorry to spam the thread but this really hit home.

Bob... kudos to you and everyone else for orchestrating this!

-I love how you keep turning away in the video, before you give up the goose, because you are trying so hard to keep a straight face.

-Then it doesn't hit Steve really until you pass over the AOPA document.

-Then Steve asks if his family knows about it and will be there at Litchfield.

You couldn't of pulled it off any better. You know all you folks that pulled it off are going to be asked to plan a whole bunch of other hi-jinks now! LOL

Being born in St. Paul and still having family in the area and North Dakota, your references in the article hit home.

Got to get the uninitiated up there now for some snipe hunting. ;)

Classic!
 
Right On!

Being judgmental, some seem more "deserving" of good fortune than others. My bad, but it simply does not get any better than this! What a perfect fit and a perfect execution of the surprise!
 
AOPA

AOPA,Bob Collins and Twin Citie RV- group,
Thanks!!


Congrats Steve:eek:


Co-Conspirator
Jim(butch) weckman
 
Congrats to Steve, and a great story. Laughed out loud when the Debonair asks the RV to pull it back another 10 knots......

cheers

Geoff
 
We had briefed at KSGS with the guys that Steve had to be #1 for departure and we needed a good two-minute head start from them out of Winsted to give the Debonair time to form up.

As Steve was taxiing out to take off on the turf, I saw Tom Horne -- who'd been circling a few months off the arrival end of the runway -- turn away from the field, and I thought, "Oh, no, this is where the whole plan falls apart."
 
Great story and video, but many of the comments following it are more than a little unsettling.

Yeah, there's always going to be some sour grapes from the "you don't love us as much as you love them" crowd, but really there are only a few there, so that's encouraging.

It speaks, though, to the amount of energy we waste as a species constantly trying to define our differences, and failing to recognize that we are all kindred spirits.

I made up -- sort of -- the narrative that we're this group of people who just fly out to places we've never met before to meet people who are on the airport, but we do fly out together quite a bit. I think our challenge as aviators is to constantly be meeting those new people and expanding the comfort zone of small circles.

If there had been no AOPA, no Debonair and no surprise, yesterday STILL would've been a great day. I got to meet two RVators I didn't know before.
 
Yeah, there's always going to be some sour grapes from the "you don't love us as much as you love them" crowd, but really there are only a few there, so that's encouraging...

I saw your comments as a response to (I assume) kitplanes vs. production, But I found the comments concerning the winner being "undeserving" because he already had an airplane as silly. Its the "...why should he get two when I only have one..." thing. I would expect that kind of "class warfare" from other social groups, but AOPA? ...seems out of place
 
Thanks for the very special day

Id like to send a special thanks to all the RV guys: Brian, Michelle, Vince, Mike, Brad, Pete, & others Im sorry about missing the names...and especially Bob Collins that flew with me yesterday and were in on the surprise AOPA airplane give away sweepstakes. What a great bunch of guys to fly with and what day! I will always associate you guys with that day . I hope to fly with you guys sometime in the future after I figure out what to do with this new airplane/tax obligation.... $54K ouch! Bob thanks again it was sure nice talking with you both before and after the give away. Also in terms of the Cardinal, Im not sure yet as to what Im going todo with my 1/2 share. I want to make sure my good friend and 1/2 share owner of the Cardinal are part of the decision. For now its wonderful to have this new problem and be tasked with nothing but "upside" options. Take care all and fly safe.:)
 
Steve,

Congrats on the win, but I am puzzled...

How does "winning" an airplane that is supposedly worth $150,000 result in a tax obligation of $54,000? That's airway robbery!
 
Congratulations Steve!

What a great story, and especially neat was the role Bob played in this - not sure who had the bigger grin as the "7" came in for landing.

Regarding the "sour grapes" responders, I'm reminded of the VP of engineering of my prior firm. He and his wife escaped Czechoslovakia 40 years ago with no English language skills, and a single suitcase with his diploma hidden in the lining. He's had a very successful career here.
I once asked him why they were willing to risk their lives in an escape, and he told me in America, you can look at a beautiful home and think to yourself, if I work hard, I can have that too. A communist, on the other hand, will look at the same thing and the first thought is, "if I can't have it, then he shouldn't have it either". Interesting.
Terry, CFI
RV9A N323TP
 
Yeah, but -- without getting into politics -- if you've gotten a pilot's certificate at all you've worked hard and have shown the discipline to do so.

It is certainly a reality in our "hobby" that owning a plane is an impossibility -- or seems so -- for a number of people after they put the effort in to learn to fly.

LSA was supposed to solve that problem but a look at LSA prices immediately showed that idea didn't work.

For many of us, the answer was obvious -- build a plane. My guess is that too many people aren't aware of this option , although it appears obvious to us.

And AOPA certainly isn't doing much to call attention to this option.

I chalk up the sour grapes to an immediate and unthoughtful reaction to a reality: people want to fly and they feel locked out.

I think every time we fly to a far-away airport in our RVs, drop in, and willingly show what you can do without being a millionaire, we help ease that feeling.

We just need to keep telling our stories and recognize that there are tons of pilots who haven't heard them yet, even though we might tire of repeating them.
 
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How does "winning" an airplane that is supposedly worth $150,000 result in a tax obligation of $54,000? That's airway robbery!

For federal and state income tax purposes, the value of prizes received by contest winners is taxed as ordinary income. There is no difference whether the prize is in cash, such as a lottery, or some other form such as trips, airplanes, baby sitting services, etc. If the AOPA airplane is valued at $150k then that amount is added to the winner’s taxable income for the year and, for most people, taxed at the corresponding higher marginal tax rates.

You really didn’t think your federal and state taxing authorities would forego their pound of flesh on such a joyous occasions did you? :D
 
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For federal and state income tax purposes, the value of prizes received by contest winners is taxed as ordinary income.

Hello, my name is Mike. Welcome to the "Church of VAF" where we take you closer to God in heavenly chariots that our missionaries build and fly. You can donate a chariot also! Bless you!
 
The complicating factor with regard to taxes (some of mine are used to make really nice runways and take care of my neat small airport, by the way) is that it's based on the FMV of the prize which fell from the sky.

One of the things I learned on my visit to SteinAir this morning, is the companies that worked on the plane and put new equipment on the plane, indicate full sticker price because they get some bigger tax break themselves by doing so, shifting the tax burden over to the winner.

Ideally they'd indicate a lesser value for the components and service but I suppose I can't begrudge them wanting to dodge as many taxes as possible, too.

No matter what, when all is said and done and even after taxes, someone ends the day with a pile of cash they didn't start the day with.

Which is cool.

VERY few winners of the AOPA airplanes, I learned today, actually keep them because, in many cases, it doesn't fit the mission . If this had happened to me, that's what I'd do. I already have an airplane for what my mission is and family situation is.

But one of the most exciting parts about THIS airplane is that the Debonair seems to fit Steve's mission perfectly.

BTW, I bet the bottom-feeders come out of the woodwork over the next few weeks making Steve some ridiculous low-ball offers, knowing he has a tax burden on his hand. I reserve my disgust for them.
 
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Congrats

Congrats on the win!!! Very cool.

Regarding taxes, Brother Dan Horton can probably enlighten us on the potential tax bill. He won the Husky a few years ago.
 
Hello, my name is Mike. Welcome to the "Church of VAF" where we take you closer to God in heavenly chariots that our missionaries build and fly. You can donate a chariot also! Bless you!
Thank you Father Michael for your welcoming encouragement! ;)

VERY few winners of the AOPA airplanes, I learned today, actually keep them because, in many cases, it doesn't fit the mission.

This is not the only reason.

It is a seldom published fact that in the majority of cases where a person wins a high-value non-cash prize, the winner is forced to sell the prize to generate the cash required to pay the associated tax burden. The net benefit to the prize winner resulting from this scenario is typically less than casual observers assume. A contributing factor to the under-realization is that in many cases the non-cash prize cannot be sold for 100% of the prize?s ?taxable? value. And when this occurs the prize winner does not get to reduce the value of the prize for tax purposes to the selling price. A simple example makes well the point. If you win a car valued at $50k but can only sell it for $40k you end up with $40k to cover the tax obligations associated with $50k of taxable income. After paying federal and state taxes the net winnings can easily be only 30-40% of the original prize value. No question this is still better than not winning at all, but the net results can be underwhelming compared to the initial euphoria associated with wining the prize in the first place.
 
A hearty congrats to the winner! Sell the Cardinal 1/2 share to pay the taxes and enjoy your new (slower) Debonair. :D

The obvious moral of the story is that if you get a call from Bob Collins asking to hitch a ride ... don't question him. Just tell him to hop in, strap in, mount his camera and start smiling, because something GREAT is about to happen! :D :D :D
 
This is not the only reason.

Right, I didn't mean to imply it was the only reason and in "not fit the mission," that includes the cost vs. the reward and there's also the insurance, hangar etc.

I don't minimize any of those, at the same time I don't feel as though a winner is a victim* in these scenarios. If they walk away with $100,000 in their pocket, I'm not going to get incredibly worked up because it wasn't $150k.

Either way, they had a good day.


(* - to clarify, since I talked to him last night for more than an hour, in no way is Steve suggesting he's a victim. But in these discussions, as they turn more political, there is a level of outrage about the alleged unfairness. I do have sympathy for the burden that taxes can cause , but it's more for the person whose house is underwater, lost their job, sold the home for pennies on the dollar, and had the good fortune of having half of the mortgage forgiven. The taxes are assessed on the mortgage that was forgiven as if it was income. Nobody seems to be skating on the tax bite except the ones who have the wherewithall to game the system. Meanwhile some guy on Kickstarter asks for $10 to invent potato salad, and Americans throw a quick 50 grand at him. It's a great country! )
 
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In the pre VAF days I contacted AOPA about restoring a J-3 Cub, Champ, Tcraft, Luscomb, and Ercoupe and give them all away to different people in the same year. They could do comparison stories on them all year and the five winners could probably afford to keep them.

They didn't want to hear it but I still think it would be a cool way to go.
 
Regarding taxes, Brother Dan Horton can probably enlighten us on the potential tax bill. He won the Husky a few years ago.

Just another example of why I'm the luckiest SOB you ever met.

Steve, that was a great landing, all things considered.

Bob, ya did good.

Ok gents, this is the sort of notable event that should result in call signs. For Steve, "Lucky" or "Snipe Hunt" might do. The REAL question is one for Bob, given his talent for devious dealings ;)
 
Ok gents, this is the sort of notable event that should result in call signs. For Steve, "Lucky" or "Snipe Hunt" might do. The REAL question is one for Bob, given his talent for devious dealings ;)

Checkoway gave me one but then it disappeared when he did.

"Haybale."

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6.jpg


OK, it was actually straw, but close enough.
 
If you win a car valued at $50k but can only sell it for $40k you end up with $40k to cover the tax obligations associated with $50k of taxable income.

Unless the IRS has changed, we didn't pay tax on the higher amount. My wife won a car on a game when we lived in California. We sold it back to the dealer for less than the stated value on the 1099-MISC. When we filed our federal taxes we used the lower amount and the IRS sent us a nice letter about a year later asking why the amounts didn't match. We replied in about 3 sentences basically telling the story above and about 6 months later they sent a reply (on a postcard that I saved) that the explanation was sufficient and no further action was required. Oh, and she enjoyed meeting Alex Trebek.
 
BTW, lost in all the brouhaha on the Debonair is Steve's RV-7. That is a BEAUTIFUL airplane and I think it's the fastest one I've ever been in. He's clearly an excellent and detail-oriented builder. Makes me want to do mine over. :eek:
 
Right, I didn't mean to imply it was the only reason...

Just for clarification, my intention was not to undermine your point but rather to point out another (albeit more common) reason why winners often sell their prizes. :)

I don't minimize any of those, at the same time I don't feel as though a winner is a victim in these scenarios.

Who said anything about winners being victims? I was merely stating the economic facts and realities associated with winning a high-value non-cash prize. :confused:
 
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Unless the IRS has changed, we didn't pay tax on the higher amount. My wife won a car on a game when we lived in California. We sold it back to the dealer for less than the stated value on the 1099-MISC. When we filed our federal taxes we used the lower amount and the IRS sent us a nice letter about a year later asking why the amounts didn't match. We replied in about 3 sentences basically telling the story above and about 6 months later they sent a reply (on a postcard that I saved) that the explanation was sufficient and no further action was required. Oh, and she enjoyed meeting Alex Trebek.

I?m glad the situation with your wife?s winnings worked out in your favor. However, these matters are not cut and dried with the IRS?I have personally seen them take a contrary position in similar matters.

Prizes are taxed on their Fair Market Value (FMV). IRS regulations intentionally allow that there is no fixed manner or method by which FMV is determined. Therefore, they may permit some reasonable leeway but one should not automatically assume that ANY subsequent sales price of a prize will be accepted as FMV for reporting purposes. FYI?
 
slow down

I got to deliver the prize airplane down to Sun and Fun one year with Steve Ell's from AOPA. It is a fun event and lots of work go into the refurb of the prize.
But, the best fun today... was watching a video where somebody radios to an RV to slow up please, so we can catch up.
Priceless.... and of course the lucky guy looking over his shoulder at 9 o:clock.
Just fun !!!!!!!
 
Cograts Steve

Steve,

congrats on the Debonair win. It's really a nice plane and hopefully a great fit for your family! I'm glad I got to be a small part of the plan to give it to you, what a fun day and a good time visiting new airports. There are a group of RV'ers, many as SGS, that fly almost every weekend, so by all means lets meet up again for more RV flying.

Bryan Flood
 
I got to deliver the prize airplane down to Sun and Fun one year with Steve Ell's from AOPA. It is a fun event and lots of work go into the refurb of the prize.
But, the best fun today... was watching a video where somebody radios to an RV to slow up please, so we can catch up.
Priceless.... and of course the lucky guy looking over his shoulder at 9 o:clock.
Just fun !!!!!!!

Steve was cruising at 170 kts and when he slowed up, I'll bet he was down to about 115 or so and the Debonair was still struggling to catch up.

The plan was it would be orbiting just to the east of the field when we were about to leave Winsted. I left the tour of the Waco project to walk up to the terminal building to go to the bathroom and look for the Debonair.

I thought I heard it, but I'd left my hearing aid at home and with just one working ear, it's hard for me to determine the direction sound is coming from and I decided it was a tractor working the soybean field nearby.

Then as we were taxiing out, I could see it off in the distance about 4 miles or so and as Steve hit the throttle, I could see Tom Horne turning the Debonair BACK EAST in the circle and thought, "nooooooooo!"

He never would have caught us if he hadn't asked us to slow down.

And by "slow down", I think he really meant, "turn around and come back or I'll never catch you." :D

BTW, the one thing I've noticed with RVers who win these things -- 2, I guess -- is that in the scenarios on how to make it work financially, selling the RV NEVER enters to the realm of possibility.

Oh, one other note: I turned 60 this year and I'm having the best year, I think,I've ever had (knocking on wood). Lots of great moments. Every single one of them somehow involves my RV.
 
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Bob Collins was masterful!

It was a complicated plan with lots of moving parts, but kudos to Bob Collins for pulling it off with style and a sense of humor! Seven RVs, multiple airport locations, and an on-time air-to-air meet-up with a Debonair (while recording it all on video and audio) takes an expert cat wrangler -- and Bob did it masterfully! The best part was that he and his fellow RV pilots did all this for someone they didn't know (but is sure to become a fast friend). This is a testament to the generosity, selflessness, and skill of the RV community -- and the words "RV . . . could you please slow down?" are now immortal.

Dave "Pablo" Hirschman
Senior Editor AOPA Pilot magazine
RV-4
 
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In the pre VAF days I contacted AOPA about restoring a J-3 Cub, Champ, Tcraft, Luscomb, and Ercoupe and give them all away to different people in the same year. They could do comparison stories on them all year and the five winners could probably afford to keep them.

They didn't want to hear it but I still think it would be a cool way to go.

Maybe you could throw this idea to Paul Dye with the difference being the airplanes are all Kitplanes (and at least one being an RV, of course!)
 
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