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Removing Studs

Pmerems

Well Known Member
Advertiser
Gents,

I need your assistance. I installed the four studs on on the governor adapter without any issue (used some grease) using the double nut technique.

I had planned to use the VA-153 bracket (mounts to the back of the governor) on my PCU-5000X governor but the VA-153 doesn't work well with the PCU. Van doesn't sell the VA-183 any longer so I made my own version. The VA-183 mounts to the governor mounting flange and uses two of the studs.

Now I need to back out two of the studs to accommodate the VA-183 and the extra washer needed between the bracket and the governor mounting flange.

I tried the double nut trick but the nuts turned on the stud and the stud didn't rotate.

Any thoughts on how to back these studs out?

Hope I don't need to use a vice grip and replace the studs.

Thanks,
 
I've always been able to remove studs with the "double-nut" method. Sometimes it takes several tries, but always successful. First you must tighten the nuts VERY tight against one another and use the inner nut to unscrew with.
Just a few weeks ago I changed the magneto studs to install an impulse mag on the right side. These studs had been there since 1972.
 
Mel's got the right technique, you may want to try a little heat to the stud as well, heat it up but don't get it too hot. The heat will help release any stud locker or locktite that was used.
 
Double nutting hasn't worked

Gents,

I tried double nutting again and it doesn't work. These studs are in very tight. I will have to try an remover. Unfortunately I fear I will damage the studs and have to replace them. I will call Superior and see what they suggest and the cost of 2 new studs.
 
Hey Paul-

I was in your same predicament last night. I needed to drive the four studs that hold in the fuel controller on the bottom of the sump in a little bit. No matter how tight I doubled the nuts up, those studs didn't budge. I am going to give Superior a call up as well and get some new studs.
 
When I replaced the carb with the AFP servo I had to remove the studs in the sump, lots of heat from a butane torch and a pipe wrench did the trick! No amount of double or triple nutting would budge them.
 
Replacement VA-183 Governor Bracket

Gents,

<snip>
I had planned to use the VA-153 bracket (mounts to the back of the governor) on my PCU-5000X governor but the VA-153 doesn't work well with the PCU. Van doesn't sell the VA-183 any longer so I made my own version.
</snip>

Hi Paul,
Any chance you might share drawings/photos of your bracket? I'm going with a PCU5000X and will undoubtedly run into the same problem as you did. Perhaps this could be an additional product from ExperimentalAero?;)


BTW, I LOVE my DRDT-2.
 
Mel has it right... (as always) If it were me, and there are enough threads, I would do two sets of double nuts... twice the torque, and you can have two wrenches in opposing positions, i.e. one at 9 oclock and one at 3 oclock
 
As Mel said, twist the inner nut if taking off, (outer nut if tightening).

I have found a star lock washer between the nuts to help with really tight studs.

One other trick, put a box end wrench on the stud first, sometimes you cant get it on with the double nut flats off set.

First tug on wrench should be a hard fast one, sometimes even use a hammer and strike the wrench. Kinda like using an impact wrench on a tight lug nut.

Good luck.
 
anti-seize or threadlocker for reinstall?

Once the stud is removed, what is the standard on reinstalling with respect to using anti-seize or a loctite type threadlocker?
Specifially, I'm looking at replacing the mag mounting studs on one side of my O-360 (removing shorter studs and installing longer studs for IC mag). Any advice is appreciated.
 
Stud Removal

Chris,

I had sent my governor adapter back to Superior and they removed the Stud using heat and a expensive stud remover.

They told me typically you can reinstall the same nominal stud (not oversized) a few times without issue. They do recommend using some loctite if the stud goes into the case too easily.

Give your engine supplier a call to find out their recommendations. You can also call Superior Engines or Bart at Aerosport Power, I am sure they would be glad to give you advise.
 
having trouble with mag hold down stud removal

I tried the double nut method today, with and without star lockwasher between the nuts, and have been unable to budge the mag hold down studs on left side of my O-360.
Turning the inside nut trying to remove the stud just results in both nuts turning, backing the outside one off and not turning the stud.

If you're out there Mel, I saw your 100% success post comment earlier in this thread - any advice?

Sounds so easy!! I'm trying to take out the short studs I have on left side and install the longer ones for IC mag.

One other question; the longer studs have a 3/4" long threaded area on one end and a 1" threaded area on the other. The 5/16-18 nuts thread easily on the shorter (3/4" long) threaded end but don't thread onto the 1" long end although the threads look the same. I believe the longer threaded portion that doesn't take the nut easily is the end that goes into the engine accesories case side but can't find any drawings to confirm. Does anybody have access to an installation drawing to confirm this?
 
If you're out there Mel, I saw your 100% success post comment earlier in this thread - any advice?

All I can suggest is keep trying. The nuts have to be jammed together "extremely" tight. Hold the outer nut with one wrench while turning the inner nut with another. You might try soaking the threads in the case with penetrating oil.
 
I have found that heat is the key.... I had an accessory housing repaired by a reputable vendor only to find the oil pump housing bolts not installed to the right height. After trying the double nut technique to no avail, I call the vendor. They said either send it back or try some heat. I tried heating the base metal with a WalMart propane torch, Bingo? It came rite out.

Good Luck!
 
I have found that heat is the key.... I had an accessory housing repaired by a reputable vendor only to find the oil pump housing bolts not installed to the right height. After trying the double nut technique to no avail, I call the vendor. They said either send it back or try some heat. I tried heating the base metal with a WalMart propane torch, Bingo? It came rite out.

Good Luck!

Scott is right on about the heat. I had problems removing STUDS from a cylinder head and accessory case. Heat did the trick and they came right out. Yes I know that one does not like the idea of putting a propane torch to their expensive engine part made out of aluminum BUT that is the key to getting the stud out.
 
success and some frustration....

Thanks all for the advice. I was successful in getting the short studs out today and got one of the longer replacements installed, but gummed up the threads on the clamp end off the other replacement stud so will have to order a new one and finish up next weekend.

The lower short stud came out fairly easy after getting a little more aggressive on tightening the double nuts together per Mel's comments. I added a third nut too but not sure if that made a difference. Other thing I did differently was giving it more of a yank on first movement rather than the steady pull. Don't know if that made a difference either, but was happy to get the old ones off the engine!
The top stud was a little harder to get out. Even with the double nuts torqued together very tightly, I was still getting slippage of the jam nut and no rotation on the stud. A couple cycles with the heat gun did the trick.

I was within a turn or two of finishing install on the second longer stud when the double nuts slipped without continuing the stud rotation. Wasn't quite in flush with the hole on the other side of the case so I tried to tighten the double nuts together a little more and finished the install. But after removing the outside nut, the inside nut wouldn't rotate off; it was jammed on there good and was just rotating the stud back out. I backed that inside nut towards the case a bit and could see that the threads on the clamp end had been damaged pretty good...so I removed that one and will order a new one. May try using a cap nut for install this time and see if I have better luck.
So good progress, but I was hoping to finish the mag install today. Hopefully next weekend....
 
Slick parts price vs equivalent Lycoming P/N

Just wanted to thank Mel for p/n info in thread at:

http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=14211&highlight=mag+stud+part


I went to order replacement stud from Aircraft Spruce and because my original parts were supplied as a kit, I was surprised to see that the only option on AS web site was Slick kit M3413 (two of the longer studs) for $48.50.
I looked on A.E.R.O. web site and found same for $42.50 but they listed alternate parts at between $6 and $10 each. With that big a price difference it was hard to believe these were all equivalent parts, so I did a little more searching and found the thread above and additional information on the Sacremento Sky Ranch web site confirming what I really needed (Lycoming p/n 31C-19). A.E.R.O. was out of stock on most of those they listed at the lower prices but I found one on Sky Ranch site for $10 (bought two just in case I screw another one up.....).

And at the risk of thread creep - thanks Doug for the great VAF resource. As I'm sure others have experienced, this is just one of many times these forums have saved me either time or money, or both (my wife says the time is a wash with the time I spend on VAF site....) so although I qualify for the "who shouldn't donate" list on the VAF donation page, I made my contribution today - thanks, and I wish you much continued success.
 
Replacing studs?

Looking for help from the engine experts:
I'm mounting my Hartzel governor and 3 of 4 studs appear to be 1/8" short so i order 3 new studs 31C-16 as recommended by the lycoming manual. I remove the first "short" stud with the double-nut, vicegrip & heat method and it just happens to be the same length 2" that the new studs are. So do i replace it with the same length stud but dont screw it in as far (1/8" less) ? Or do i buy 31C-19 which are an extra 3/16 longer?
Is there a requirement (AC43.13??) for how much of the stud is inserted into the base material? I havent found it if there is.
Any help is appreciated.

Keith Sremaniak
 
I know it?s an older thread, but I want to share my experience in case someone trying to pick the collective brain on this issue, like I did.

I am installing a spacer at the intake and needed to replace the studs in the cold sump. The instructions for installing the new studs call for applying a high temperature ?permanent/red? thread locker. I suspect so is the case with other studs on the engine that go into an aluminum body. So, I assumed that the original studs that I needed to remove were installed with a ?permanent? thread locker. Now, any permanent/red thread locker that I know of requires heat for removal. I guess, with enough brute force, the fastener would come out without heat, but I was afraid that especially with aluminum, brute force might damage the threads in the sump.

To cut to the chase, I carefully applied heat with a small butane torch (just enough for the oily stud to start smoking oil), keeping the flame away from the sump and the studs came right out with the double nut method. I?d be apprehensive trying to force the studs out of aluminum substrate applying much more torque than what is specified for torquing the stud into the hole or bolting a nut onto the stud ? that out of fear of stripping/damaging the threads.

I did try first removing a stud without heat and it wouldn?t bulge with a reasonable amount of torque.
 
Perhaps. But a point I was trying to make was that as far as removing studs from aluminum or magnesium alloys are concerned, brute force with or without a stud remover/extractor might not be your friend. What?s likely holding the stud stuck is a threadlocker, which needs to be released with heat.
 
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