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Mac or Windows

Mac or Windows based

  • Apple Macintosh

    Votes: 140 48.6%
  • Windows based

    Votes: 104 36.1%
  • Both

    Votes: 35 12.2%
  • Other

    Votes: 9 3.1%

  • Total voters
    288
  • Poll closed .

RV7Guy

Well Known Member
Doing some research for potential product development. Would like to get as many as possible to check in on this.

Thanks in advance!!!
 
Why choose?

No need to paint yourself into a corner. It's pretty easy these days to design most types of applications to be platform-independent.

And to answer your poll question (did not vote): Windoze and Linux.
 
MAC!

As much as I enjoyed the multitude of quality conversations I had with "Bob" in New Delhi while getting customer support for my pc, I find that the ease of use and incredible reliability of the Mac more than makes up for this downgrade of my social life. I guess PC user just get tired of having something that works flawlessly every time. I confess that I did have to take my 7 year old Mac laptop in for service a couple of years ago....I needed a bigger hard drive. Up front cost is greater but I found that after every 2-3 years I had to replace my PC because it was slow as molasses. The cost evens out. I'd like to get a new Mac but my current one just won't die. I never had that issue with a PC.
 
The question was not which is better / easier to use, but which is better for product development - presumably with profitability in mind ;)

We produce a software product (commerically) for a bunch of pilots (2000-3000), and is available as a PC/Windows product only. Ditto our competitors. Ditto most software. The market is far wider for the PC, and although biased, development is easier / more resources out there IMHO.

There is a growing (and vociferous!) Mac community. However, starting from the minority viewpoint, tools / software / hardware have been developed (Intel Macs, Parallels, emulators, Wine, Online via RDC) that allow Macs to run PC software. Not a lot the other way round...

So yes - if it is easy write for both - although ensure the average PC dummy can install it. If you have to make a choice, I'd advise PC everytime - and ensure the product and installation are very easy to use - if the user needs to understand the word "file" or "directory" you are lost :eek:

HTH?
Andy

PS The Mac bunch will then whinge, as they do :D Get one of them, give them the product for free, and write instructions for how to use the product on a Mac via the above methods.
 
Update: Poll modified per Darwin's request. dr.


I would think that there needs to be a ‘Both’ choice, Darwin.

The reason I suggest this is because there are a lot of us out there running Windows-based software on a Mac (using Parallels Desktop 7 for Mac, etc.). There are even folks running Mac stuff on PCs.

If I had to pick just one, it would be Windows (because I can easily run those applications on both types of computers). I consider myself a Windows guy, but I have a Mac also. :D

A screen grab of my stat software shows a lot of the browsers hitting VAF last week were designed (at least initially) for Windows based environments:
ae09dv.jpg
 
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As Andy just said, Windows has a much larger customer base. I do all my commercial app development on a Mac running Parallels but sell primarily to the Windows crowd. If someone insists on running my stuff on a Mac, i tell them to get Wine or Parallels. Now the portable stuff will require some work as you will have to learn iOS for Apple or Android for everything else. (Learning Cocoa for iOS will pretty much get you familiar with programming for the Mac.) I really do like the development tools on the Apple platforms. Well thought out with a language that does a LOT of stuff with very little code. Just wish the Mac market was bigger, although the trend seems to be towards the tablets and smart phones. Have fun.
 
I've had a Macbook Pro all through college and won't go back to a PC. Too slow, too many faults, too prone to viruses. Never had an issue with my computer. Due to the availability of more software on a PC, get a Mac with a lot of memory so that you can run BootCamp and run Windows when needed and still have plenty of memory on both sides. Just need a Windows OS installation disc to run BC.
 
Why not make it web based?

Personally, I'm a Microsoft fangirl (Don't judge. It pays for the -10. ;)) but, if you want to make it available for all audiences, you should consider a web based app. Most things my clients ask for in a desktop application, I can duplicate on the web.
 
It is interesting that at this point, Mac is leading in the poll.

Overall, I think it commands about 5% of the market. But this forum is may not be representative of the rest of the world, people here are special. :)

(Mac user since 1985)
 
Mac Flight Planning Software

I have used both for many years. I bought my first Mac in 1984 and never looked back. I used mostly pc's at work.

My biggest complaint is the lack of flight planning software that is Mac based. Yes, I have been using Voyager on the bootcamp/Windows side of my Macbook Pro but it is convoluted, at best, with all of the typical Windows based issues.

I think the future is Mac iOS based software (or other tablet os). When Apple bring's out their 7" iPad model next year (rumored) it will be the perfect cockpit size (and I hope screen usability is better).
 
don't ignore the dark side

This is being written on a Fedora Core Linux computer with a Chrome browser. If I were starting any new software development projects today I would focus on the iPad/Android Tablet platforms; with Java being the implementation software of choice. Just one ancient software developer's opinion. My only claim to fame was being president of the company that wrote the first Unix based project management software and statistical process control software.
 
I run mac everywhere I can...but have vmware so I can do windows stuff on the laptop when required. I don't have a problem with windows, just got turned to the mac stuff with the iphone (as I am sure many did). Come to think of it, I only carry the laptop when I might need to do some reprogramming of one of our products in the field! So my vote is iPad!

PS...I'm the only person at TruTrak running Mac...not a surprise that I'm the odd one!
 
Unfortunately, there are a few programs that I have to use for FAA that won't run on MAC.
 
I have to admit I'm a little shocked. While I don't opine that one OS is better than another (I'm Windows but only after MS killed OS/2 and I have use for both Mac - pre and post OSX - and Unix), but I would have expected people who build their own airplane to embrace an OS where they could get under the hood. So I really expected the numbers to be Unix/Linux, Windows, and then Mac. I am also shocked by that browser pie chart. IE in the lead? Really?

So much for my biased preconceptions. Next you'll tell me Santa doesn't exist.:rolleyes:
 
Jumped to the "Dark Side" with Mac about eight years ago. Absolutely no regrets and would not want to go back. Our old desktop iMac G5 is a Power PC machine, so we are starting to find some issues upgrading to newer software that needs the Intel powered machines. Our Macbook is an Intel machine, so it is becoming primary. I have resisted installing the Boot Camp on it because I just don't want all of the Microsoft issues. I did install Word for Mac and it works great. Beyond that, I have not had an issue with programs that won't work on Mac. Rosie the Riveter now has an iPad 2, as well.
However, I am using my SkyPad 2 with Voyager in the airplane, so I still have that PC connection. I got the lifetime charts when I bought it during Seattle Avionics Black Friday sale a couple of years ago, and obviously I don't want to give that up.
You can put me down solidly in the Mac column.
 
I have to admit I'm a little shocked. While I don't opine that one OS is better than another (I'm Windows but only after MS killed OS/2 and I have use for both Mac - pre and post OSX - and Unix), but I would have expected people who build their own airplane to embrace an OS where they could get under the hood. So I really expected the numbers to be Unix/Linux, Windows, and then Mac. I am also shocked by that browser pie chart. IE in the lead? Really?

True. I would think that Linux would appeal to more do-it-yourselfers in the crowd. I'm a Linux guy and I have been for quite a while. I use Linux at home and at the day job.

I keep a one lowly Windows partition on my home PC only for the purposes of updating my Garmin, updating kids' toys, etc. I literally use Windows about 1hr every two months...if that much.

If you want to build a real, cross platform app and it's not incredibly complicated, the best way to do it is to build it with a cross-platform windowing toolkit such as QT, WxWidgets, etc.

I do this for a living. I write code exclusively on Linux that runs on Windows, Linux and Mac. Making software cross-platform is relatively easy if you know how to engineer software properly.
 
Bought my first Mac this spring and hate it. So right now I'm using a Mac but that won't last.

Reasons for hating it - general unreliability; frequently dropping the wi-fi connection or the printer connection; saving files in the folder which was last open not for this file but for the previous file I was working on; and for having minimalistic opportunities to set preferences. Also for saving to the overall "documents" folder without providing an opportunity to select an appropriate sub-folder. In other words, generally poor user interface.

Dave
 
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Kind of depends I suspect...

I suspect that it really depends on what the target is. If you're shooting for mobile, at least at this time is iOS and Droid, but if you're targeting the desktop, you're probably safe with Win.
 
Some more stats on VAF

I found the 'Show by Operating System' option for the stat software. Nearly 70% of the visits hitting the site run Windows. Darwin, maybe this helps...

2jcbl11.jpg
 
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Started with an Apple II.
Moved to PCs to make a living.
Now, I've moved back to Macs and started developing for iPads & iPhones.

It all comes back to the appreciation of the innovators vs the imitators.

The MacBooks are a very well designed product in comparison to the current PC laptops.
 
Windows is what I have to use at work, although myself and many of my friends are going to Mac for home use as well as all mobile use. It may be a comming trend??
 
Mac only

I know every time I have to use Windows for something, I feel like I need a shower afterwards. I will never go back!
 
Bought my first Mac this spring and hate it. So right now I'm using a Mac but that won't last.
Dave

I relate to this. Couple years back, I spent $1,000 or so on a macbook. After 8 months, I was relieved when the screen went south. I went out to walmart, bought a $400.00 windows laptop and never looked back. I mean really. No "delete" key? Come on.
 
It is interesting that at this point, Mac is leading in the poll.

Overall, I think it commands about 5% of the market.
That was the case for a very long time. But things have been changing. A few years ago, the Mac market share started creeping up. First 8% then 10% by most accounts. I heard a geek podcast just last week where they quoted something like 15% if I remember correctly.

I think there are several factors at work that brought this about. The gigantic mistake that was Vista sort of got the ball rolling. Then app support finally reached critical mass and people were finally able to do just about they needed to do (Garmin updates have already been mentioned) without having to keep a Windows partition on the machine which, quite frankly is far beyond the ability of 98% of the user base even with bootcamp and/or parallels. And lets not forget the the relentless level of marketing that Apple does.

So market share is finally coming around for the Mac. That being said, if someone was looking to choose a platform for future development at this point, I think Mac and PC are both the wrong choices. Both platforms will be dead within 10 years as far as the consumer grade market goes. The future is iOS and android.

From what I understand iOS has the market cornered right now as far as aviation software goes but that won't last. The past always repeats as they say and while there once was a day when no self respecting musician would use anything but a Mac, today the PC-based audio production software market outpaces the Mac based market by a large margin.

So I think I'd be looking to get in on the ground floor of the android market at this point. Its not a question of if android will become the dominant platform in GA cockpits, its a question of when IMO.
 
The disproportional response of the Apple cult

I'll probably get flamed for this post... but here it goes ;-)

Interesting to see the striking differences between the poll results and the actual data that DR posted. Interesting, but not too surprising. Without commenting deeply on the relative merits and demerits of each platform (over the years I've owned Apple, Windows, and Linux systems, currently the latter two), I'll comment on some interesting sociological phenomena that I think explain the differences in the data.

In recent years, Apple has gained some market share, and within it, quite a cult following. Many of Apple's customers seems to worship it with almost religious devotion, and that fervor tends to come out when the topic arises, as it did in this thread. In other words, it appears that Apple users, while a small minority in reality, are exceptionally vocal about their love for Apple, and more likely to express their preference of OS when asked. Windows users on the other hand, who do in fact comprise a large majority, simply use the product matter-of-factly without worship or fanfare.

So why the fanatical devotion of the Apple cult versus the seeming indifference of the Windows masses? I can see a variety of reasons (I guess I will comment on some differences between the platforms after all...). Apple for its part has cultivated a high-end niche market and has done a pretty good job with its product offerings within that niche, but most of all has done a brilliant job of creating a certain image that appeals to its customer base. Microsoft on its part has not had the same level of success in creating an attractive image for its brand, and in fairness, nor are its products quite as polished as Apple's, technically or otherwise. MS does however still offer a much better value for the majority of its customers than does Apple (cost/benefit), and is a much more open platform than Apple, giving Windows users more flexibility in matching their own computing needs and budgets. In short, Windows users are not restricted like Apple users to a very limited market of overpriced hardware and software, largely monopolized by a single player.

Ok, flame suit on :)

P.S. Again for the original poster: best thing you can do in app development is maintain platform-independence.
 
Mac by choice/PC by work requirement

At work, I use two different low-volume high-end automobile accident reconstruction graphics softwares based on the DirectX video codec. My home computer is a Mac.

When I finally asked the software manufacturers the right question: "Is the reason you don't offer a Mac version because your code is too unstable to pass Mac certification tests?" the answer I received from both was "You are correct."

So I put up with crashes because the end justifies the (very frustrating) means. One learns to copy and rename files A LOT!

Here is my observation about business philosophies:

Mac wants its users to succeed. They will give you all the one-on-one tutorial support you want for $100/yr.

PC's business philosophy is what I call the "Las Vegas" business model:
1. Welcome to Las Vegas
2. Give us all your money.
3. Now go home.

Mac has been more than generous re warranty claims - even replacing the broken screen on my daughter's laptop which was damaged she caused.

For those who cite PC's user volume, just because something is ubiquitous does not necessarily mean it's good. For years AutoCad has been the most popular CAD design program. It is cheap, but it's not ProE or any of the other quality higher-end CAD programs. At least AutoCad now has a snap command, so it has evolved from "etch-a-sketch."

Larry Tompkins
N544WB -6A purchased flying
W52 Battle Ground, WA
 
For those who cite PC's user volume, just because something is ubiquitous does not necessarily mean it's good.

Case in point: McDonalds. They sell stuff that's only remotely akin to food (my opinion) yet they're #1 in the world because of smart business decisions -- not the quality of the product they actually sell.
 
Larry,

It isn't as simple as "good" or "bad". Relative "goodness" can and should be examined on all relevant dimensions when choosing between two alternative offerings.

To Jamie's example: Sure, most people would prefer a filet mignon over a big mac. But people eat many more big macs than filet mignons because big macs offer a better value for the money, and for most people that's a factor that must be considered.

Apple's offerings cater to a high-end niche that is willing and able to pay the hefty premium, and is willing and able to operate within the closely guarded confines of Apple's walled garden. Microsoft's offerings cater to everyone else who is unwilling or unable to justify Apple's premium for marginal benefit, or is unwilling or unable to be confined to Apple's walled garden.

Right now it seems that the two offerings can coexist happily in the market, and I think that's great. But yes, considering the tradeoffs, there really are good reasons why many (most) people and organizations still choose Microsoft over Apple today.
 
Stay on task...

I believe the point of the original post, is to discover what platform pilots use (like?) and would be willing to purchase software for their use.

As of this post, we have 228 replies.
DR says he has 14,914 registered users on Vansairforce.net

So, if you are planning on making a significant engineering decision on about 1.5% of the population you wish to serve, you may want to reconsider your data gathering technique.

Advice about platform independence is the best advice in the posts. But software performance that is coded to the native chip is almost ALWAYS better. Not sure what your application does, but if performance is an issue, AND you want to make money, target the platform with the most hardware available, or sell the hardware too.

Dkb
 
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I believe the point of the original post, is to discover what platform pilots use (like?) and would be willing to purchase software for their use.

Dkb

OK, Like Comfortcat said, stay on point. My point is, I am not an electrical engineer (Roee - sorry to use you as an example but you started it ;) Apple products just work without having to be a geek (some say I am). I took back a 1 1/2 year old MacBook Pro (6mos out of warranty) for a minor screen resolution issue and Apple ended up giving me a new one (the newest model). Try that with another brand.

POINT - I just want aviation products that I don't have to spend a great deal of time rebooting/configuring/antispamming/etc/etc/etc

ps. Roee, you are right, most Apple fans are more supportive and fanatical about their purchases. They probably got that way from owning pc products they had to constantly spend a lot of time fixing.

pss. Apple iOS or any mobile system you want to develop for is probably the way to go.
 
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Thanks-keep'm coming

Just a couple of comments at this point. 1) I was a Windows based user for years. My best friend switched to Macs for business purposes. He tried for years to get me to convert. I too, felt the Apple clan was cult like. (just like the alternate engine group. Sorry couldn't resist, extra cup of coffee today).

2) Then, I had a bad run with a Gateway, then Dell. Got a Mac. In 5 years, I had only one problem, a bad hard drive. They fixed it for $00.00!!! I dropped my Macbook and cracked the screen. Repaired for $00.00!!!

3)Go to the Mall. The busiest store in the Mall is the Apple store.

4) I have seen other survey's in other venues with similar results. Not surprising here.

5) With the iPad, many who were Windows users are transitioning at the next opportunity. I am now completely Apple. Just got the iPhone 4S last week after having a Droid X. Next purchase is the iPad 3 when it comes out next year.

Again, thanks. Love reading the comments. Merry Christmas everyone!!!
 
Don't tell anyone... for some reason Apple wants to keep it a secret....
But, Mac is really UNIX:eek:
 
OK, Like Comfortcat said, stay on point. My point is, I am not an electrical engineer (Roee - sorry to use you as an example but you started it ;) Apple products just work without having to be a geek (some say I am). I took back a 1 1/2 year old MacBook Pro (6mos out of warranty) for a minor screen resolution issue and Apple ended up giving me a new one (the newest model). Try that with another brand.

POINT - I just want aviation products that I don't have to spend a great deal of time rebooting/configuring/antispamming/etc/etc/etc

Gary,

You can pick on me, I can take it. And yes, I did ask for it ;)

I completely agree that there's value in a product that require less "fussing" to get it working and keep it working right. That used to be a major advantage of Apple over competing products. But while Apple still has some advantage there, that gap has very much narrowed between Apple and Windows, and believe it or not even Linux. But Apple still has some advantage there on the software side, no doubt.

The flip side of that coin though is that on Apple products, the hood is welded shut. When things are working as they should, that's great. But when inevitably they don't, you're entirely dependent on the graces of the mothership for a solution. In many cases, as you pointed out, the solution comes from a trip to the Apple store. Ok. In other cases, when you run into something you need that simply isn't supported, then, well, you're just SOL.

It's also interesting to me that one of the most common anecdotes I hear from Apple fans in favor of Apple, and yours is a perfect example, is something like the this:
"The [hard drive, or motherboard, or display, etc.] on my MacBook [crashed, or broke, or brunt out, or stopped working in some way]. Apple replaced it for me for free. When it happened again a year later, again they replaced it for free!"...

As far as reliability goes, at least on the hardware side, it doesn't seem that Apple actually does all that well. But to their credit, they do give great customer support when their products do break.

On the non-Apple side, there is a greater diversity of hardware available, and one can procure a system that is either more reliable or less reliable than a Mac. It does however, as you point out, take a little bit more homework or know-how to choose well. Where Apple leaves you no choices, in the non-Apple world the choices are yours to make.

And on the customer service side in the non-Apple world, there is also a diversity of options. It's just that you don't get Apple-style comprehensive service by default built in to the purchase price of the product. It's a choice you have to make, and pay for explicitly if you want it. Dell, for example, offers several different levels of service contracts, including at the higher tiers on-site support (they'll come to you and fix your problem). That kind of service contract isn't cheap of course, but if you feel you need that level of service, it's available at your option. What's important to note is that comparing say a Dell Windows machine to an Apple of similar performance, the Dell Windows machine will be far less expensive than the Apple even if you opt in to a top tier service contract.

ps. Roee, you are right, most Apple fans are more supportive and fanatical about their purchases. They probably got that way from owning pc products they had to constantly spend a lot of time fixing.

That hasn't been my experience. My PCs seem to have been more reliable than Macs. But I do make sure to use high quality hardware (not necessarily expensive, just well chosen).

pss. Apple iOS or any mobile system you want to develop for is probably the way to go.

Mobile vs non-mobile, depends on what the application is (Darwin, care to share?). And if mobile, iOS vs. another OS... Consider that iOS market share has flattened out at about 30%, while Android is now at over 50% and fast growing. But that's the market at large. We don't know the relative market share among RV pilots, which is presumably the target audience for the product Darwin is developing. But again, in any case, I would advocate platform independence to the extent possible.
 
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I first asked about both as I started to use Mac 2 months ago. Cannot do everything I need on Mac. Had to install VMware and Windows to do most of what I need. Still had to go to my backup PC as I could not use the Mac to get things done in a timely manor.

I love my Apple iOS iPhone 4 and iPad 2 but after 2 months, I am still disappointed with my MacBook Pro. Had to buy Microsoft Office 2011 as iWorks was a disappointment. Apple Mail was also a HUGH disapointment but fortunatly Thunderbird works great. My new i7 Win7 with 16 GB RAM has only been running 2 weeks and I like it better than the MacBook Pro. The i7 is set up with removable Hard Drives so will have Lynux and maybe a Hackintosh set up for it.
 
The MacBooks are a very well designed product in comparison to the current PC laptops.
In comparison? They are PCs. Intel processors, AMD graphics. The only real difference is the OEM-installed OS.

Check out the new HP Envy 15 and Envy 17 laptops. (just released Dec 7th).

Blatant ripoff of the aluminum-framed MacBook Pro. Ships with Windows 7 64-bit, of course, but can run Mac OS via Hackintosh, and also of course all the popular Linux distros that have drivers for the laptop-specific hardware.

I just got the new Envy 17 3D for Christmas. It's stunningly beautiful and the best computer (laptop or desktop) that I've ever owned.

RV-related: First custom thing I did to it was to set a picture of the RV-8 as the desktop wallpaper :D

PS: A 17" Mac Book Pro, equipped similarly to my new HP Envy 17 will cost you around $800-$1000 more, and they are assembled in the very same factory in Shanghai, China.

Edit: Here's a funny cartoon that depicts a big difference between Linux, Windows and Mac users: http://www.stickycomics.com/computer-update/
 
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I use and prefer a MAC for my normal life. In my work life at GE Aviation, we use Windows..... however, the IT guys don't like it. There is a movement to go Mac, and I hope it happens. There is no question that the apple operating system is superior. The ony reason windows/doss is the PC of choice in corporate America, is because Bill Gates is a superior business man and Steve Jobs wasn't for a long time. He was 'Mr. Anti-establishment' at a time when personal computers were in their infancy, and it cost Apple the win in the PC world - for a while. Can you imagine what it would be like if Steve Jobs wasn't so focused on ideals and instead was willing to sell out to corporate America? Windows, a later Microsoft development that operates in conjunction with doss, and prone to all sorts of operating system faults and viruses, would be competing with an operating system that is better in every way. Microsoft wouldn't be in business today. Maybe that would be bad, because Mr. Gates has given so much to charity. I bought a mini PC because I needed it to update my Dynon. Why Dynon has chosen to use only one operating system (the wrong one) is my only bad mark against a good company. I've had numerous problems trying to get this mini-PC working properly to update my EFIS and other Dynon hardware. It takes 3X longer and is a pain in the butt compared to what it would be using my MacBook or iPad. If anyone at Dynon is listening, please consider making your equipment compatible with Apple. It's just not that hard to do, and would help many of us out - plus you wouldn't have as many problems. It's a 21st century solution........
 
Well, if you want to talk computer politics, Apple never had much chance after they came out with the Macintosh because the user base back then were largely computer hobbyists and they closed the system. I had great fun with an Apple II (that for all I know is still handling a Material Return Database at ROLM) but went with the PC because I could get under the hood. By the time Windows was making the switch from a DOS shell to an operating system, I was already using OS/2 and enjoying multitasking that even Unix wasn't fully capable of delivering but MS managed to partner IBM and then kill OS/2 (I notice that some of the kernel code reappears in Windows today).

In the meantime, Apple continued with its niche of consumer-oriented products (and let me add that it's an important niche as the user base is changing from nerds to everyone), while MS is slow to catch on but a glimmer appears. Eventually, Apple realized that it couldn't stay behind the technical curve forever, and leveraged a more popular OS with Apple's own UI magic; a brilliant move IMHO. Windows is still struggling with UI issues but at least has addressed the huge reliability issues; I've got a server running Win7 continuously for two years now with no crashes. Meanwhile, no one is minding the Unix/Linux shop ... or I should say that it's run by committee, with better than predictable results.

The preceding is a vast simplification of over 30 years of OS development and totally sidesteps the fact that no OS is superior to another in all ways; they are all compromises of design elements. Sound familiar, airplane builders? The three major camps (I don't consider OSX just another Unix build) each have their own set of successes and failures and I don't feel a bit disloyal when I use any of the three where the situation merits. I was grateful for OSX servers to replace the NT servers that required constant care; I'm equally happy to be back on Windows servers, but I still like Mac workstations in a support environment. But I've been in an academic setting (I'll be teaching Computer Science starting Spring Semester) and right now Linux is the best platform for networking. Then there's embedded systems which have no OS (or no named one) at all.

Why do I stick with Alienware and Windows, then? Remember that server I mentioned? It's on an Alienware laptop. Both the hardware and OS have to be reliable for that to work; and that also means good system integration. Apple does it, but Alienware was doing it for PCs while Apple was still a closed system. And I dual Linux, no problem; I could also dual OSX were I so inclined but who has the time? That's not to say that my system is 'best' or that I think everyone should use the same thing. What I really think is that all this 'my OS can beat up your OS' BS is really useless. The OP asked a useful question for software platform support and I think Doug provided him with the most useful info; much of the rest has just been run-of-the-mill OS bashing. Scratch the paint and you'll find primer wars underneath. :D


[ed. The chart Patrick is talking about (from my VAF server stat software): dr]

2jcbl11.jpg
 
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