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-   -   Transfer of control in tandem airplane? (https://vansairforce.net/community/showthread.php?t=89421)

Jeff A 08-04-2012 10:12 PM

Transfer of control in tandem airplane?
 
As I am nearing the end of Phase 1, and trying to complete a comprehensive POH, I have a question for all of you military pilot types out there....What is the PROPER way to transfer control of a tandem airplane from one seat to another? What is the proper phraseology/terminology to ensure both pilots don't sit there with their arms folded thinking the other person is flying the airplane? Although the scenerio is slim, I've read more than one accident report that has dealt with this subject, and want to know what the best course of action is. Thanks in advance....

Flyguytki 08-04-2012 10:19 PM

The way I have always been taught (non Military) is a three part process to ensure both are unstood. It begins with the Non pilot saying " I have flight controls" as he/she grabs the stick, then the Pilot says, "You have Flight Controls" and the Non pilot/now pilot will finish with "I have Flight Controls" Until all three of these are heard or said the one who began with the controls will not stop flying.

Not exactly what you asked for but this has worked and is pretty fail safe.

-david

Stump 08-04-2012 10:43 PM

one way to trasnfer control and it works comm out
 
Shake to take, pump to pass.

first, with intercom capability, clear statements

"You have the aircraft"

"I have the aircraft"

comm out, person flying lightly presses rudder pedals such as left, right left (pump) to gently wag the airplane

nonflying person then lightly 'shakes' the stick to take control, enough that the airplane moves in roll, that way the flying pilot knows the nonflying now has the control.

comm in, i also shake the stick lightly even when verbalizing "I have the aircraft"

if ever in doubt, continue to fly the plane...

Tandem46 08-04-2012 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flyguytki (Post 686210)
The way I have always been taught (non Military) is a three part process to ensure both are unstood.

Yep, pretty much how we do it in the Navy. We call it a "positive three way transfer of controls".

Snowflake 08-04-2012 11:18 PM

Interesting. When I learned to fly, we only did it as a two-way transfer.

If the person flying was initiating the transfer, he would say "You have control." The person taking control would say "I have control."

If the person not flying was initiating the transfer, he would say "I have control." The person giving control would say "You have control."

I can't think of a situation where we needed more confirmation than that, but that's probably because I just didn't run into one...

RVZoomie 08-04-2012 11:48 PM

as an additional confirmation...
 
with students where the instructor sits in the back seat the 'shake to take, pump to pass' for comm out an additional technique is for the front seater (student) to raise their hands to the canopy so the back seater can see the student is no longer trying to fly. Unless you have formation mirrors, its difficult to get this to work the opposite way. Technique only...

ao.frog 08-05-2012 12:44 AM

My wife and me...
 
.... and (all the other ones I fly with too ofcourse), use in our -7 too.
Works as well in a side-by-side as in a tandem.

The no-com transfer (shake-to-take / pump-to-pass) was a great way of transfering, and I think that can be useful when the VHF is busy with lots of talk. Thanks! :)

FlyArmy 08-05-2012 02:08 AM

I fly a side by side but our technique is pretty standard into the tandem apache community. 3 parts....verbal (positive three way) visual (showing hands off the stick if relinquishing) and tactile (shake her to take her, especially under NVGs). Positive meaning you never use negatives, ie "I don't have the flight controls", because if the radio cuts out on the don't, no one is flying the plane. 3 way meaning "i have the flight controls, you have the flight controls, I have the flight controls". Too redundant? Maybe, but I've heard of several instances where no one was flying the airplane. Additionally, the army is pretty big on saying "flight controls" because if you say "you have the airplane", but copilot thinks pilot is referring to traffic and says "I have the airplane" and the pilot relinquishes control unbeknownst to the copilot...no one is flying.

Jeff A 08-05-2012 08:11 AM

Thanks everybody. All great repsonses. That's exactly what I was looking for. I know that most people (non-military) have been taught a certain way or have a way they like to transfer the controls. I only specified the military pilots because having worked on the Apache way back, I know they have a black-and-white SOP for transfer of control, and was curious as to what it says.

2bolts 08-05-2012 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snowflake (Post 686218)
Interesting. When I learned to fly, we only did it as a two-way transfer.

If the person flying was initiating the transfer, he would say "You have control." The person taking control would say "I have control."

If the person not flying was initiating the transfer, he would say "I have control." The person giving control would say "You have control."

I can't think of a situation where we needed more confirmation than that, but that's probably because I just didn't run into one...

That's how they used to do it in the UK too. At least when I was training.


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