Anyone using ElectroAir Electronic Ignition?
 

I saw this system while down at SnF.

www.electroair.net

They aren't newcomers but I don't know of anyone using one.

Reports???

:confused: CJ

ElectroAir
 

Been around for years. Many units installed. New owner.

Yup.

AKA "Jeff Rose Electronic Ignition".

O-320, one mag, one ElectroAir. Works as advertised.

James

Original ElectroAir
 

I talked to Jeff, inventor, founder when he had the company years ago. Very nice guy. As was stated above new owner and their web site as lots of info. http://www.electroair.net/ (they have lots of detailed info on their site)

I have a friend who has dual electroair (original design) on his RV-4 for at least 8 years. The design has changed; How I don't know. The coil pack and electronics where all together (but separate from the trigger). Now the coil pack, electronics and trigger are all separate. They offer crank trigger or trigger mounted in mag hole. I think they use a 60 tooth (minus 2) "reluctor" trigger verses a hall affect design trigger. Reluctor pickups are super simple and reliable and used on OEM auto ignitions a lot. Hall affect uses a semiconductor pickup that senses a magnetic field. Electroair does some boasting on their site there reluctor 60 tooth minus 2 trigger has 1/4 crank resolution. You all can debate if that matters? They both work.

I have heard of almost no complaints of Electroair. One person did have an issue with a manifold transducer "soft" failure causing intermittent rough running problem at altitude in climbs. The problem was found and solved. Electroair is unique in that they do recommend aircraft plugs not auto plugs, but they provide harnesses for both. I don't like how they do their aircraft plug harness connection; there have been no problem; I just don't care for how its set up; there's nothing stopping you from using auto plugs. From Jeff's experiments he found performance improvement with aircraft plugs. Lightspeed recommends auto plugs but can make aircraft plug harness as well. The auto plug connection with typical silicone boot/clip is easy and light, and also apparently lightspeed found with super high spark voltage, arching of the typical spring contact inside aircraft spark plugs can occur.

The other complaint seems to apply to most all EI brands, kick back during start due to low voltage. That is not a common thing but varies. Some have no issue at all. Wire wound starters like the original SkyTec fly-weight starters are current hogs. If you add weak battery and lousy wiring you can have issues. Common fix is a second small aux battery isolated with a schottky diode to keep voltage up during start on the EI. If you have one EI & mag (usually the impulse coupled one) its not an issue, just start on magneto. However EI usually gives better starting. Lightspeed claims their unit (CDI) works with lower voltage than other EI's (induction), thus less susceptible to low volt, kick-back.


I liken the ElectroAir to be in between the Light Speed & E/P-mag in design and configuration with likely performance advantage over the E/P-mag due to larger coils, my opinion.

Lightspeed has probably the best performance and options. Of course trigger, coil and electronics are installed separately. Lightspeed is a CDI ignition system. Plasma II ($1,120-$1,315), *Plasma III ($1,395-$1,590) *MSD - Multi Spark (capacitor) Discharge

E/P-mag has the self powered option and best installation ease (all in one package). Down side is no doubt coil size is a compromise (one smaller coil). It is an "induction ignition". $963-$1365 (plus $115 for gear if needed)

Electro Air, is like E/P-mag in that its an "induction ignition" design like E/P-mag, but has installed separate components like lightspeed. It uses a hall effect trigger in the mag location. I suspect the two large coils performs a little better than E/P-mag? When I say better, I mean more spark. Any EI, any brand is a huge leap beyond the spark of a magneto any way. The electroair like lightspeed has some (or the original did) ability to display advance and turn it off with a toggle I recall. The functional difference between the original and new design electroair I'm not sure of. ($1,275)

I do like the idea of having the electronics in a separate location verses the E/P-mag all in one location. On the other hand the fit/form/function of the E/P-mag is pretty slick being all in one unit. The only thing I don't like is the wire terminal connection strip on the E/P-mag. It's not a great thing for electrical connections on something vibrating.

Cost wise they all cost about the same when you add it all up. Lightspeed has been around the longest. Klaus has been accused of being grumpy but he is sharp. I have heard nothing but good things about the E/P-mag people. Nothing is perfect but the customer service is important. I asked Electoair questions and they got back to me quickly, straight shooters, no bragging, we are the best in the world, just good info. They have what looks like a good product.

Update: I wrote Electoair and they got back to me quickly and answered my questions in full. Their unit does have capability to display timing advance when you wire up a user supplied panel volt meter at your option. You can turn the vacuum advance off if you wire in a toggle switch at your option. They have a mag timing housing that uses the impulse gear which could save you money. When going from mags to dual EI, lightspeed and E/P-mag require you use only a straight gear. When you have two magnetos you only over one straight gear. The impulse gear & couple are different and can't be used. Electroair has mag timing housings that use either straight gear (usually right mag) or impulse gear (usually left mag). This saves you from having to buy a new gear if you have an impulse gear to use in the left position. They also have redesigned and improved their aircraft plug harness connection at the plug. Again they offer both auto or aircraft plug harnesses but recommend the aircraft plugs.

Electroair System
 

I have the Electroair system plus a magneto. The timing is via a device which fits in the spare magneto hole.

My Electroair system has been running without problems since 1999 and has 800 hours of operation in my RV6A (Lycoming 180 hp).

I use the system at start up with a B&C starter and have never had any problems with kick back even when the battery started to get a little tired and needed replacing. Engine starts first time and idles at low RPM as smooth as a car.

I consider I have had excellent results with the system and would recommend it to anyone. Obviously I can not compare it to other systems but I have heard that the Electroair folks give excellent customer support in case you should have any questions or issues with their system.

What more can you ask for?

Barry F-PRVM

Electroair stuff uses primarily Electromotive components: http://www.emi.cc/

They have sold 1000X more systems than all the other aviation EI companies combined so are vastly experienced.

Failures and problems with these on automotive use seem to be magnetic crank sensor pickups and inability to start at very low voltages and/or very low cranking speeds. NSI used these on their conversions as well.

I've been flying with one Electroair ignition and one mag for about 500 hours.

I have had two component failures during that time. The first was the prox switch that measures crank rotation. It failed at about 40 hours in service. The failure effectively pointed out one of the major concerns with flying behind a <realatively> low volume experimental ignition - support.

It was the week of SnF and I was unable to contact the manufacturer for a week (they were at Snf), so I was grounded at my home base. That was a bummer, but would have been a real problem if I'd been on the road somewhere.

More recently, the little LCD voltmeter that serves as an advance meter died. This gauge isn't necessary for flight, it just gives you information on the number of degrees of advance where the ignition is firing.

All, thanks for the replies.

This seems like a good, simple system where all the components are visible and easy to understand and troubleshoot.

I like these properties and think it will augment the traditional mag nicely.

Say, those who are using this, do you have an impulse coupling on your traditional mag so that you can start on "both"?

Do you think the coupling is necessary?

:confused: CJ

Electroair
 

Yes I have impulse coupling on my Slick magneto.

I start the engine with both the Electroair and the magneto turned ON.

Barry

Replace right mag, keep impulsed mag (left)
 

You almost always replace the right mag, the non impulsed mag. If you see my post above I updated it in BLUE at the bottom. Most EI can't use the impulse gear which is different than the straight or none impulse gear.

Electroair has recently designed a second mag timing housing MTH that can use an impulse gear. They also have a MTH that uses a straight gear. The impulse gear attaches to the impulse assembly. As the engine turns the gear, it pre-loads a spring in the impulse coupling while the mag does not move, than "CLACK", the wound spring is released and spins the mag "catching up" to the engine. This fast spin gets voltage up for a hotter spark during start. Juice for spark is provided by the magnetos dynamo and proportional to rpm. Low rpm low spark. The impulse couple mechanism also delays timing. If you notice the left impulse mag usually has a spacer and longer studs? That is to make room for the impulse gear and assembly. Once the engine is running the impulse mechanism locks out and the mag is driven normally, 1:1 speed with engine and normal timing (25 deg). A&P's please correct me if wrong, that's how I see it.

If going with one EI, it's usually an advantage to retain the impulse magneto so you can start on it if you want or need to. Not withstanding the EI low supply voltage issue, during starts, EI usually do better than the mags during start because of the hotter spark. EI also electronically retard to timing to Zero and advance to 25 degree only when RPM comes up after start.

Most leave the regular mag off (impulse or not) during starting and start on the single EI. However never start with a straight mag on during start since the fixed advance can cause kick backs. The key switches on aircraft turn off the straight mag during cranking. Most people with a regular mag and EI use toggles but the Electroair can be used with a key.

It probably would not hurt to start with both the EI and impulse mag on together. It might even be good to start on the impulse mag only, occasionally, to make sure it works. However usually start on EI and than turn the magneto on.