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-   -   Using Call Sign in uncontrolled airspace (https://vansairforce.net/community/showthread.php?t=164516)

flyinhood 09-26-2018 07:10 AM

Lots of people now have ADSB on their screens. But many of us don't and regularly fly airplanes without ADSB or even transponders.

I also fly / instruct out of a busy GA airport. RVs, Cubs, and Barons are not uncommon in the pattern at the same time.

"hey, did you see that Cub you almost ran over?"

"what do you mean, hes not on my screen!"

(long exhale)....

I try to embrace the Both And approach. Screens are great. I love them. I also love good communication and looking out the window.

If there is 3 red RVs in the pattern...than yes that would be dumb to not use your tail number and more exact position (maybe a landmark on the ground). But, if your the only RV, I think its more informative as other posters have said, RVs are becoming more known.

As far as "experimental" in the non-towered pattern, my thought is that this is not as helpful as it could be because there are so many different kinds of experimentals. Pietenpols (sp?) and an RV 8 will approach the airport at different speeds. So both saying "experimental 5 miles out" is not very informative.

For this reason, I sometimes transmit my time from the field.

"Nowhereville traffic, red RV, 5 SE, 2,500. We are 3 mins out and plan on entering the left downwind"

We did this A LOT in the corporate world when we would bring a jet into a non-towered airport.

All just food for thought.

roadrunner20 09-26-2018 07:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbo69bird (Post 1291186)
I would guess that due to the ADSB mandate they are expecting people to see the n number on their screen and be able to locate that specific airplane better. Kind of relying on electronics more than visual cues which goes against everything I was taught as a pilot but that’s probably the idea.

I don't believe ADS-B has a mandate to send your n number since you're able to send an anonymous OUT.
The FAA may know who you are, but your EFIS won't.

Turbo69bird 09-26-2018 07:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roadrunner20 (Post 1291205)
I don't believe ADS-B has a mandate to send your n number since you're able to send an anonymous OUT

Mandate to be in all airplanes by 2020 was the mandate I was referencing.

lr172 09-26-2018 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbo69bird (Post 1291208)
Mandate to be in all airplanes by 2020 was the mandate I was referencing.

There is no mandate for all planes to have ads-b by 2020. The requirement is to be ads-b equipped in order to fly in A,B & C airspace + >10K. Many planes will be flying outside of rule airspace without ads-b after 2020.

Larry

airguy 09-26-2018 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kuhtenia (Post 1291141)
As a new'ish private pilot and even newer RV-6A person, I find the tail numbers to be increasingly useful as ADS-B becomes more the norm. After hearing the call I glance at the area traffic to confirm I know where that person is, and the tail number makes an easy confirmation (if so equipped).

I've heard it more frequently lately, and have used it myself a few times, on initial callup to approach that an aircraft will reference their location in distance/direction from another aircraft that approach is talking to, based on seeing them on ADSB. In many cases that's a faster way to identify an aircrafts location than "28 miles east of international". Just this morning flying in to work I was monitoring approach from 30 miles out, and made my first call at about 22 miles out - but gave my position as "5 northeast of Zero Sierra Romeo" that approach was already working. It may not be "AC/AIM approved" or even official by regulatory standards - but it works and I've never heard anyone called out on it, myself included.

alcladrv 09-26-2018 08:27 AM

I don't think anyone really thinks that using your N-number in your call sign is primarily for visual identification.

I also use the call signs, however descriptive they may or may not be, and location to develop a mental traffic picture of the local airport area. If I'm planning to takeoff and hear "XYZ traffic, white high wing Cessna entering left downwind runway xx," I know about where to look. Then after a minute or 2, when I've completed my checklist and am literally ready to go, and I haven't seen nor heard from him about a base leg or final turn, I will specifically try to contact that plane and find out where he is. It is whole lot more effective to ask over the radio, "Cessna 1234, where are you?" than to query the white high wing Cessna about his location.

Just think about it, wouldn't you respond quicker to a direct question including your name like "Tom, where are you?" versus "Tall guy with brown hair and red shirt, where are you?" It is why most all instrument panels have the N-number prominently displayed in front of the pilot instead of the color of the plane. That N-number tells you who you are.

pvalovich 09-26-2018 08:38 AM

RV 192NM
 
There are a lot of slower white airplanes out there. I always use RV 192NM to let pattern traffic know that there will be a faster RV approaching the pattern.

philcam 09-26-2018 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Albery (Post 1291132)
But for controllers.....

"Blue and White RV over Fisk, rock your wings!...";);)

Mark, I think you meant "blue and white RV over Fisk, rock your wings, good rock RV, now turn left and return to Ripon...." at least in the 2018 mess!


And to keep this from a thread drift, I use an abbreviated call sign, just type and the last 3 of the N number at noncontrolled airports.

Snowflake 09-27-2018 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonJay (Post 1291082)
Curious to know. Is there something in the regs I don't know about, missed, or changed? You don't even need to talk at all, so I would be surprised if not using an N Number would be in violation in uncontrolled airspace.

Might want to check that. In Canada at least, if you're flying out of an uncontrolled field but you have an operable radio, you must make radio calls. Are the regs in the US different?

RV8iator 09-27-2018 09:36 AM

Irrelavent..
 
With the size most people are flying their patterns these days the color of an aircraft is moot. They are just black dots 4 miles away.


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