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-   -   Missing Rivets (https://vansairforce.net/community/showthread.php?t=145665)

DonFromTX 01-13-2017 07:32 PM

Missing Rivets
 
Looking back from the baggage bulkhead into the tailcone for a final check before covering up that hole - look what I spotted. I dread getting my old body folded up and back in there to do a couple of rivets. How did I ever miss them? (the photo is sideways, that is the center bottom of the tailcone.)
[IMG][/IMG]

rockwoodrv9 01-13-2017 07:49 PM

I get my grandkid to climb back in the tail section for me. No way Im going there!!

RFSchaller 01-13-2017 08:34 PM

In my first two annuals I found about 6 rivets I missed. I guess none were the golden BB,

RVTrumpet 01-13-2017 08:43 PM

Tail Stand
 
Before you climb back to set those missing rivets, think about putting a stand under the aftmost tailcone bulkhead. Sure wouldn't want to accidentally turn it into a tail dragger!

DonFromTX 01-13-2017 09:34 PM

What makes me so mad is that for 6 years of living with that thing, that I never noticed it when I could have fixed it easily, like before I got total knee replacements that don't bend as well. I too have found a half dozen missing rivets during final looks at it.

DaleB 01-13-2017 10:24 PM

I found two missing rivets on the one I bought... during its fifth annual. Fortunately they were in an easily accessible spot. I'm sure I'll find the really difficult ones later. :rolleyes:

Z-EDD 01-13-2017 10:57 PM

Me too
 
I found 8 missing rivets in a tailcone bulkhead. I was just flipping through my photo album one evening when I spotted them. Fortunately they are still JUST accessible, planning on getting them done this pm then riveting the aft deck. Glad to know I'm not the only one, good luck!:rolleyes:

Mich48041 01-14-2017 08:13 AM

A friend of mine who is always in a hurry, left a bunch of rivets out. He also left some clecos in rivet holes in another location. After he sold the plane, the mechanic who did the annual inspection found the items.

DonFromTX 01-14-2017 08:29 AM

In defense of my pre-Alzheimer condition, I think what happens is when about to pull that last rivet in the string, the phone rings, or the wife calls for supper, and you never get back to that last one. Another problem, you cannot get the LP4-3 rivet into the hole, need an ice pick or a #30 drill, so you go on to the next - and the next - and finally forget about it.
None of which makes crawling back into that tunnel any more pleasant.

scottmillhouse 01-15-2017 07:00 PM

Those exact same two rivets were also missing on our previous 12 that we bought flying. When adding the ADSB antenna noticed a little movement from my weight, otherwise would never have noticed.

DonFromTX 01-15-2017 08:16 PM

I have been unable to determine why I would have left them out, makes me want to go back to the instructions to see if maybe I followed the them and have forgotten something that is supposed to be riveted in there..

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottmillhouse (Post 1142094)
Those exact same two rivets were also missing on our previous 12 that we bought flying. When adding the ADSB antenna noticed a little movement from my weight, otherwise would never have noticed.


Tony_T 01-15-2017 08:39 PM

Don, Looks like they all should have been riveted at the same time...


ScottSchmidt 01-16-2017 06:45 AM

I could be wrong, but I think they sheer.
 
I don't think any of you missed them, I believe they sheared after they were installed.
The fact that there are so many of you missing the exact same two rivets is interesting.

I remember missing those rivets on an annual once as well. When I replaced them, I put some pressure on that piece and they immediately sheared, had to replace them again.

Keep an eye on those and see if they are missing again.

rvbuilder2002 01-16-2017 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScottSchmidt (Post 1142176)
I don't think any of you missed them, I believe they sheared after they were installed.
The fact that there are so many of you missing the exact same two rivets is interesting.

I remember missing those rivets on an annual once as well. When I replaced them, I put some pressure on that piece and they immediately sheared, had to replace them again.

Keep an eye on those and see if they are missing again.

The airplane that is the subject of this thread hasn't had its first flight yet, so not likely the problem.

rongawer 01-16-2017 01:52 PM

Empathy
 
Don, I feel your pain man. I actually have a checklist now, where I go back through each step of the instruction page just completed and review every item again. It's amazing how many little mistakes I find.

I would guess you're right, that it's mostly externally induced, such as the phone rings, or my beloved brings me a sandwich (or worse, a glass of wine - which really puts a kibosh on the whole thing).

But this is what makes it an amateur build; enjoying the journey and not really being concerned with how long it takes per step.

DonFromTX 01-16-2017 02:10 PM

The first time I read your post, I thought you were way off base. Now i am thinking you may be spot on to the problem. I and my heavy son spent far more time back at that area than most and may well have sheared them off. Regardless the next time a 12 owner opens up the tailcone, it would pay to look down at that area.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScottSchmidt (Post 1142176)
I don't think any of you missed them, I believe they sheared after they were installed.
The fact that there are so many of you missing the exact same two rivets is interesting.

I remember missing those rivets on an annual once as well. When I replaced them, I put some pressure on that piece and they immediately sheared, had to replace them again.

Keep an eye on those and see if they are missing again.


ScottSchmidt 01-16-2017 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rvbuilder2002 (Post 1142306)
The airplane that is the subject of this thread hasn't had its first flight yet, so not likely the problem.

I don't think they sheer in flight, I would guess it happens when climbing in the back, possibly supported on the tail adding to the stress on the bulkheads.
Easy to test.

rvbuilder2002 01-16-2017 11:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScottSchmidt (Post 1142442)
I don't think they sheer in flight, I would guess it happens when climbing in the back, possibly supported on the tail adding to the stress on the bulkheads.
Easy to test.

Ok, I understand what you mean now, but of all of the people (3 or 4) who mentioned finding missing rivets after the build, only one mentioned that they were specifically these two rivets.

Mich48041 01-17-2017 07:37 AM

If rivets sheered off, it would seem that there would be some evidence like part of a rivet left in a hole or broken rivets laying on the bottom of the tail cone. And the sheet metal might have some damage.

scottmillhouse 01-17-2017 12:41 PM

The missing rivets I mentioned on our purchased 12 were clearly skipped. No evidence of sheared rivets or any work around them. I recall I even had to match drill the holes. Even with my 180# load there was only a little movement and never enough to shear rivets. It would take some serious loads to shear them that probably would distort the ribs in the process.

RFSchaller 01-18-2017 06:19 PM

Fortunately there doesn't seem to be a "golden rivet" that, if missed, will cause us to fall out of the sky!

DonFromTX 01-18-2017 06:24 PM

I am still baffled over those two. When I get time I am going back over old photos (I took a lot of em) and see if they are missing back then or not.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RFSchaller (Post 1143046)
Fortunately there doesn't seem to be a "golden rivet" that, if missed, will cause us to fall out of the sky!


DonFromTX 01-18-2017 07:26 PM

I went back in time, to 2011 to be exact, and those rivets were certainly there! Obviously I did not drill them out, so maybe crawling around in the tail does shear them off. Regardless, it is something that should be looked at next time you have the tailcone open.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DonFromTX (Post 1143051)
I am still baffled over those two. When I get time I am going back over old photos (I took a lot of em) and see if they are missing back then or not.



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