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-   -   RVs Crash Worthiness (https://vansairforce.net/community/showthread.php?t=145122)

flyboy1963 12-24-2016 12:37 PM

let's learn and act from their painful lesson......
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dlomheim (Post 1136468)
......... the pilot's head struck the instrument panel and was lacerated, but thankfully he survived. .........

One of my pet peeves is the razor sharp edge of the glareshield. Look at a 30-year old car,....the dash is much more friendly to impact than our cabin.
especially with the long belt attach run in the RV, you ARE going to hit things with your head...especially if your impact has side or other loads, which is the norm.
even helmets lack much face protection. Think long and hard about all the **** you are suspending in front of your face, I know I have a big portable GPS and some other elements that will cause me grief. Most of us have iPads and things that will fly around on impact.
There is much to be learned from a crashworthiness audit of our cabin and restraint system.
(A previous post referred to the Glastar/sportman, whose steel cage is credited with an extremely low fatal crash rate.)

RV7A Flyer 12-24-2016 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rv8ch (Post 1136470)
This seems to be correct. If we stall and pancake in, our chances of survival are lower. Here's an interesting paper that talks about this, mainly related to helicopters.

https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/14b...8a671a0a35.pdf

Quoting one of the greats:

Years ago I went to a talk by an NTSB investigator who talked about this (and had some pretty gnarly photos to go with it). He said that in many cases (most?) where the plane is stalled and thus falls to earth, rather than a controlled crash "landing", what happens to the human body is that the sudden stoppage causes all the internal organs to basically continue on their way downward, tearing away from the rest of the internal structure. The lungs and airway tear away, and if the occupant is still miraculously alive at that time, they suffocate because there's no longer a viable airway. Gruesome.

Bottom line...never, ever, ever stall the plane during an emergency landing...fly it all the way through the crash and you will probably live. Stall it in...game over, man.

gasman 12-24-2016 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlomheim (Post 1136468)

The most interesting thing about this accident that he related is what happened to the RV airframe after it went "beak to beak" with a large dump truck. He said as the pilot glided into a California DOT parking lot, it just cleared a hook and ladder fire truck, bounced once or twice and then had a head on collision with a parked dump truck. The deceleration loads were transmitted through the pilot's shoulder straps and to the aft longerons where they attach. That loading pulled the tail into itself until it couldn't crush together anymore; and since there was still energy to be shed the double row of rivets that secure the tail section to the front (at the back of the baggage area) were all sheared off! This then allowed the tail section to slide forward, and the pilot's head struck the instrument panel and was lacerated, but thankfully he survived. Hearing that story again affirmed for me, how crucial it is (in a forced landing), to ensure we maintain enough airspeed at touchdown to kill the descent, and then take our chances w/any ground objects we might encounter.

Here is where a properly designed brace between the two harness attach points at the longerons could absorb some of the energy and reduce the chance of the head to contact the panel.

f1rocket 12-24-2016 01:57 PM

In an off-field landing, the goal IS NOT to land at the slowest forward speed, it is to land at ZERO vertical speed. Keep that in mind and you have a chance.

rightrudder 12-24-2016 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by f1rocket (Post 1136605)
In an off-field landing, the goal IS NOT to land at the slowest forward speed, it is to land at ZERO vertical speed. Keep that in mind and you have a chance.

Yeah, belts are designed to take the loads of a frontal collision. So glad that our planes are designed for 5-point harnesses. Make sure the lap portion is positioned low so your pelvis takes the load, not your abdomen.

GalinHdz 12-24-2016 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenNabors (Post 1136537)
First, if you can make it to an airport or large flat area and control the closure rate with the ground (vertical velocity), you are going to survive. You may crunch the plane, injure your pride, but you are going to see your family. If you forget to fly the plane and stall, you are going to die.

Having survived an RV9A crash that completely destroyed the aircraft with my passenger and I receiving only minor injuries I can state this is so very true. I will never forget December 26, 2012, 5:45pm at KSSI.




The famous Bob Hoover, who survived several crashes, once said (paraphrased) "Never stop flying the airplane. If you have to, fly it all the way through the crash."

:(

grubbat 12-24-2016 09:52 PM

Crash
 
Galin,
Not sure if you have shared the details already, but if not, I would be interested in hearing about your -9a incident and fire. The pics look scary.


Quote:

Originally Posted by GalinHdz (Post 1136653)
Having survived an RV9A crash that completely destroyed the aircraft with my passenger and I receiving only minor injuries I can state this is so very true. I will never forget December 26, 2012, 5:45pm at KSSI.




The famous Bob Hoover, who survived several crashes, once said (paraphrased) "Never stop flying the airplane. If you have to, fly it all the way through the crash."

:(


GalinHdz 12-24-2016 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grubbat (Post 1136669)
Galin,
Not sure if you have shared the details already, but if not, I would be interested in hearing about your -9a incident and fire. The pics look scary.

In 2013 I did a short write up of the incident for our website in the ADVENTURES section under the 2012 "Almost 3rd Annual Florida to Caribbean" trip. After the crash, I swore never to fly again but several pilot friends helped me overcome my fears and am eternally grateful for that. Since then I have talked to other pilots that have had similar incidents to help them possibly get back into flying.
:cool:

dlomheim 12-25-2016 01:23 AM

9A Accident
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by GalinHdz (Post 1136671)
In 2013 I did a short write up of the incident for our website. After the crash, I swore never to fly again but several pilot friends helped me overcome my fears and am eternally grateful for that. Since then I have talked to other pilots that have had similar incidents to help them possibly get back into flying.
:cool:

Galin: Thanks for sharing your story, and I'm glad it all ended with only the loss of the a/c! No doubt there are freak and unpredictable weather anomalies out there that can exceed the performance of even an RV...

Doug

rv8ch 12-25-2016 06:02 AM

weird weather
 
I've seen things that make me never want to underestimate weather. Saw a rogue gust of wind from the right rear lift a wing on a landing T6 (if I recall correctly) and put him off the runway. I can't imagine that there was anything he could have done to predict or prevent this. Thankfully no injuries.


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