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-   -   Possible AD for certain NAVWORX ADS-B Units (https://vansairforce.net/community/showthread.php?t=142967)

DaleB 01-03-2017 12:36 PM

I've also seen, on another board, posts by someone (probably the same guy) who says his wife worked in some unspecified capacity for Navworx at some unspecified point in past, and who may or more likely may not have the slightest clue what's going on. So far those posts have not included anything that would indicate either he or his ex-employee wife have any information that the rest of us don't have, which is to say... they're essentially clueless too.

Ain't the Internet grand? I guess we all watch and wait to see what happens next. I hope they work it out.

dtw_rv6 01-03-2017 01:10 PM

Does anyone see the hypocrisy here?

FAA and Dynon are putting non-TSO D10a in Part 23 aircraft and the world hasn't ended. Navworx puts a non TSO GPS in an EXPERIMENTAL airplane and the FAA acts like we will see 747s crashing into GA aircraft daily.

I certainly can't see any consistency here, but that is probably an unrealistic expectation from me.

Kudos to Dynon for their efforts by the way. Hopefully they don't get steamrolled in a similar way at some point.

Paul 5r4 01-03-2017 01:24 PM

Hypocrisy.... yep, a perfect synonym for POLITICS!

I wonder how the FAA would respond if the general public were somehow made aware, (and understood), the magnitude of reduction in safety actions like this cause.

BobTurner 01-03-2017 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dtw_rv6 (Post 1138848)
Does anyone see the hypocrisy here?

FAA and Dynon are putting non-TSO D10a in Part 23 aircraft and the world hasn't ended. Navworx puts a non TSO GPS in an EXPERIMENTAL airplane and the FAA acts like we will see 747s crashing into GA aircraft daily.

I certainly can't see any consistency here, but that is probably an unrealistic expectation from me.

Kudos to Dynon for their efforts by the way. Hopefully they don't get steamrolled in a similar way at some point.

Not quite the same.
1. Ultimately, the FAA wants to get rid of radar and use ADSB-out to keep the airliners safe. Airline safety is way more important to the FAA, than having a small plane crash due to loss of attitude info.
2. Perhaps more important, Dynon has worked hand-in-hand with the FAA (and EAA) to make this happen. Not saying this happened with NavWorx, but an open spirt of cooperation seems to work better with the FAA than an advisarial relationship.

MartySantic 01-03-2017 04:06 PM

Anyone have any idea of the accuracy/inaccuracy of the TSO'd GPS chip vs. the non-TSO'd GPS chips. Are we talking a few inches, a few feet, a hundred feet or a mile. My iPhone shows my position sitting in the kitchen within 10 feet as shown on the Google map.

Will the FAA come clean and discuss this issue, which appears to be the main issue in a response?

emuyshondt 01-03-2017 04:25 PM

The issue is not so much the accuracy when everything is working, but rather the ability to detect that the satellites being used to calculate the position are all working properly and thus the calculated position is accurate. This is the System Integrity Level (SIL) that is causing heartburn for Navworx. There are a lot of technical details involved, beyond just how accurately located a plane is when everything is going right.

I've seen my position jump a few times using my iPad. Usually it is something momentary, or sometimes they are conducting GPS tests. The cheaper receivers don't examine or report any problems with the data being received.

MartySantic 01-04-2017 10:31 AM

Has anyone tried to visit Navworx in Rowlett, TX?

lr172 01-04-2017 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dtw_rv6 (Post 1138848)
Does anyone see the hypocrisy here?

FAA and Dynon are putting non-TSO D10a in Part 23 aircraft and the world hasn't ended. Navworx puts a non TSO GPS in an EXPERIMENTAL airplane and the FAA acts like we will see 747s crashing into GA aircraft daily.

Big difference. The FAA is not using the D10A's output to separate traffic. I frankly don't have a problem with the FAA being conservative on this. The output of these units will, some day, be the sole method of aircraft separation. I don't want a midair because some guy decided to use a cheap part. I could care less if he falls out the sky for the same reason. While I don't believe in regulating victimeless crimes, that does not apply to ADS-b equipment.

Larry

lr172 01-04-2017 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobTurner (Post 1138853)
2. Perhaps more important, Dynon has worked hand-in-hand with the FAA (and EAA) to make this happen. Not saying this happened with NavWorx, but an open spirt of cooperation seems to work better with the FAA than an advisarial relationship.

From my observations, Bob is right on here. The Navworx fiasco is squarely upon their shoulders, not the FAA's. The Dynon cases are examples that the FAA is being at least moderately cooperative in working with vendors to allow flexibility.

Larry

airguy 01-04-2017 12:38 PM

Navworx may have had a valid argument, or at least part of a valid argument, but they poked the bear. You don't ever poke the bear. Nothing good comes from poking the bear.


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