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Rod Kauber
04-28-2006, 08:29 AM
Several of us are getting ready to purchase and install an autopilot in our RV4's. Leaning towards the EZ by Trio, however think both the Tru Trak & Trio are good, based on what we have read. We are interested in placing the wing servo under the ft. seat. Don't want to take off the wingtip to install it in the wing.

Anyone out there who has done this??

Would like to talk with you.

Thanks, Rod

Steve Sampson
04-28-2006, 10:47 AM
Several of us are getting ready to purchase and install an autopilot in our RV4's. Leaning towards the EZ by Trio, however think both the Tru Trak & Trio are good, based on what we have read. We are interested in placing the wing servo under the ft. seat. Don't want to take off the wingtip to install it in the wing.

Anyone out there who has done this??

Would like to talk with you.

Thanks, Rod

Rod - I am a long way from that stage yet but the 'standard' seems to be like this. Its a Rocket not a -4 but it answers the question I think.

http://www.vincesrocket.com/recent%20pics/autopilot%20servos%20001.jpg

Steve
#4478

Alex D
04-28-2006, 07:56 PM
Rod,
If you go to my link (http://www.rvtraining.com/RV-4RollInstall.pdf) you will find drawings for the roll and pitch trutrak servo installation.
You have to decide which system will best fit your needs. Please let me know if you have any further questions regarding trutrak products or installation.

Alex D

SteinAir
04-28-2006, 08:17 PM
Rod - I am a long way from that stage yet but the 'standard' seems to be like this. Its a Rocket not a -4 but it answers the question I think.

http://www.vincesrocket.com/recent%20pics/autopilot%20servos%20001.jpg

Steve
#4478

That is close to the RV4 installation, but there is a LOT less room in the -4's. We're currently installing a Pictorial Pilot and Altrak into an RV4 in our shop and believe me it's tight. That being said, TruTrak supplies a pretty good set of installation hardware and drawings to help out, and there are a lot of people who've installed them so overall it's actually pretty easy.

I'll try to get some pics of the installation next week if I get a chance.

Cheers,
Stein.

pukingdawg
04-28-2006, 10:04 PM
Stein,
I've just finished installing the servo's for the Trutrak ADI Pilot 2 and used
your prewired plug and play harness in my RV-4. Waiting for the ADI on
back order. The elevator servo was not that complicated just a real
tight spot to get into behind the baggage compartment to drill out the
old brackets and install the new ones from Trutrak. Installed the aileron
servo under the seat as depicted in the plans and pretty simple. The ADI
should arrive in a week or so and will pass along the info on the complete
installation.
N360LW
Larry

n38139
04-29-2006, 12:25 AM
I recently installed a Tru Trak pictorial pilot in my RV-4.

I ordered it from Stein Air along with the pre-made harness.

The hardest part is installing the servo bracket.

The connecting linkage between the servo and the torque tube bracket that Tru Track sent me was not long enough for me so they made me a longer "barrel" to put the rod ends into. In other words there were alot of exposed thread on both joints that I didn't care for and they immediately made me a longer one and sent it to me. They have also been very good at answering questions when I called. So far, it is the best money I have spent on the airplane, a great tool for workload reduction.

pbesing
05-03-2006, 06:55 PM
That is close to the RV4 installation, but there is a LOT less room in the -4's. We're currently installing a Pictorial Pilot and Altrak into an RV4 in our shop and believe me it's tight. That being said, TruTrak supplies a pretty good set of installation hardware and drawings to help out, and there are a lot of people who've installed them so overall it's actually pretty easy.

I'll try to get some pics of the installation next week if I get a chance.

Cheers,
Stein.

Hey Stein, I'm at this point installing my Tru Trak..any pics yet? I'm waiting on the servo to get here but am running wires, and would like to see how tight it is in the footwells for the RV-4.

Thanks.

Paul Besing

SteinAir
05-03-2006, 09:36 PM
Ohhhh, those #@$@! footwells! You would have to bring it up just now wouldn't you?!?! Ok, so we're building a new set of "shallower" footwells because the standard Van's buggers just took up too much room and didn't leave enough for the darned servo. So, now we're making larger (in sq.in) footwells but they're only about 2 inches deep. Under one side is the Strobe Power Pack (don't ask...it was already there) and the other is going the servo.

So, at the moment we're redoing the footwells, finishing up the rear rudder pedals (one which needed to be "adjusted slightly" due to it hitting the throttle quadrant up front), and just wrapping up the rear seat throttle control, building a shelf for the GRT AHRS/Remote Mag install, working out the pitch servo install, finishing up the new wheel pants, finishing the new FAB, installing a bunch of GRT probes, just finished a new cover that is camlocked down for the front center tunnel (it used to house a radio stack that we tossed), fabricating a switch/circuit breaker panel for the right hand side of the pilots seat, assembling the entire new "glass GRT panel" and trying to route wires/pitot static tubing, etc.. - that means the actual AP servo install is sort of "on hold" at the moment until we get caught up on everything else. Hopefully we'll be in better shape next week! Like all these projects, every little thing turns into a major project of sorts! We hoped to have this plane back in the air by now, but alas it just hasn't happened yet - but the owner sure would like to have it back in the air!

I promise as soon as we get back into the servo install heavily I'll post some pics.

Cheers,
Stein.

pbesing
05-03-2006, 10:30 PM
Geeze...I thought my panel upgrade and electric flap modification was a big job. Well, the servo will be here soon, and I'll test fit. I'm just not crazy about having the autopilot servo in the foot well! I can just see someone kicking the darn connector off the back of the servo...there has got to be a better way!

Sam Buchanan
05-04-2006, 07:13 AM
Original inquiry:
Several of us are getting ready to purchase and install an autopilot in our RV4's. Leaning towards the EZ by Trio, however think both the Tru Trak & Trio are good, based on what we have read. We are interested in placing the wing servo under the ft. seat. Don't want to take off the wingtip to install it in the wing.

Stein reports on the hassles of his servo installation:
Ohhhh, those #@$@! footwells! You would have to bring it up just now wouldn't you?!?! Ok, so we're building a new set of "shallower" footwells because the standard Van's buggers just took up too much room and didn't leave enough for the darned servo. So, now we're making larger (in sq.in) footwells but they're only about 2 inches deep. Under one side is the Strobe Power Pack (don't ask...it was already there) and the other is going the servo.

Maybe it's time to reconsider installing the roll servo in the wingtip? :D

Sam Buchanan
http://thervjournal.com/navaid.html

Tom Martin
05-04-2006, 08:30 AM
I have installed four servos in rockets and I mount them forward the main spar. The dimensions of this area are exactly the same as for an RV4. You have to make a little bracket that bolts to the forward tourque tube but the installation is easy and it makes the wiring runs shorter
http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/7446/navaid7tf.th.jpg (http://img524.imageshack.us/my.php?image=navaid7tf.jpg)
The tru trak installation is easier on on my last one I mounted it on the right side which works better.

Tom Martin

SteinAir
05-04-2006, 06:27 PM
Original inquiry:


Stein reports on the hassles of his servo installation:


Maybe it's time to reconsider installing the roll servo in the wingtip? :D

Sam Buchanan
http://thervjournal.com/navaid.html

Touche! - Good one Sam! It just so happens in this particular plane that the wingtips are riveted on (and quite nicely done) so we didn't want to hassel with drilling out all those rivets, then re-fitting the wingtip (which was never fun the 1st time), then repainting it to install the autopilot bracket, servo and pushrod....assuming that's the install method you're winking about?!

Otherwise, the optional install at the bellcrank working through that @#$%$ inspection hole is just about as bad as working under the floor. In our case we already had the floorboards out to build the footwells anyway - then the owner decided to have us put in the autopilot as long as we were this far. As long as the floorboards were out it's just easier for us.....

You know I sell both of these guys, and both are great. But....in this case we're installing a GRT Horizon EFIS in the panel and the guy wanted an AP that would take advantage of the GRT (using the GRT for vertical guidance as well as lateral) so that made the decision easy - as the TruTrak is the only one which will do that - for the moment :)

Anyway, that's the reason we're doing this particular install.

Cheers,
Stein.

Sam Buchanan
05-04-2006, 07:41 PM
Touche! - Good one Sam! It just so happens in this particular plane that the wingtips are riveted on (and quite nicely done) so we didn't want to hassel with drilling out all those rivets, then re-fitting the wingtip (which was never fun the 1st time), then repainting it to install the autopilot bracket, servo and pushrod....assuming that's the install method you're winking about?!

Yep, the servo mounted on the end of the wing spar was what I was teasing you with. But when the tips are riveted in place........well, guess I would be looking at other options, too.

Otherwise, the optional install at the bellcrank working through that @#$%$ inspection hole is just about as bad as working under the floor.

I agree. That would be a challenging installation in a -4 or -6. The newer RV's have more inspection holes and wouldn't be so trying, but after taking my servo out of the single hole in the wing of my -6 for an adjustment while still flying the Navaid, I was very happy the brackets had been installed while the wing was still open! :eek:

Hang in there with the -4 install. The owner will love the new autopilot!

Sam Buchanan

pbesing
05-04-2006, 10:15 PM
I would think the wire run would be just as difficult, unless you had some conduit in the wings. The wingtip was not an option for me because I've got small snap bushings in my wings that are full.

pbesing
05-05-2006, 09:28 PM
I have installed four servos in rockets and I mount them forward the main spar. The dimensions of this area are exactly the same as for an RV4. You have to make a little bracket that bolts to the forward tourque tube but the installation is easy and it makes the wiring runs shorter
http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/7446/navaid7tf.th.jpg (http://img524.imageshack.us/my.php?image=navaid7tf.jpg)
The tru trak installation is easier on on my last one I mounted it on the right side which works better.

Tom Martin

Bravo, Tom. Went to the airport today, and ripped out the wiring going to the footwells. Then I realized I had a fuel line in the way. So I moved that (thanks!). I don't have the servo yet (TruTrak) but plan on installing with your method. Easier to get to for adjustments, etc, that's for sure.

One question, you mentioned that it's easier on the right side. I had to put mine on the left as in your navaid pic above. Will the trutrak still work on the left?

Steve Sampson
05-06-2006, 02:15 AM
[QUOTE=SteinAir]Ohhhh, those #@$@! footwells!

Is there a reason not to install the servo 1 bay further aft? (behind the footwells) You would have to put one side of the rear floor in with platenuts but thats not a big deal.

I have not got to that stage yet but that was what I assumed without having the servo in my hand.

Steve
#4478

Tom Martin
05-06-2006, 05:11 AM
The servo can go on either side. You may have to reverse a couple of the leads to get the direction of rotation correct. The key is to measure from the tourque tube pivot point down to the standard push rod attach point. The bracket that you make has to have it's attach hole the same distance above the pivot point so that you get the correct throw. I make a bracket with three holes so that you have some adjustment. If you are using a trutrak servo you may need a slightly longer push tube.
I can see no advantage to mounting the servo under the floor boards. This location forward greatly simplifies the installation, adjustments and set up.

Tom Martin

pbesing
05-06-2006, 10:38 AM
[QUOTE=SteinAir]Ohhhh, those #@$@! footwells!

Is there a reason not to install the servo 1 bay further aft? (behind the footwells) You would have to put one side of the rear floor in with platenuts but thats not a big deal.

I have not got to that stage yet but that was what I assumed without having the servo in my hand.

Steve
#4478

I looked hard at this, but came to the conclusion that it's not a good idea, because the aft tube under the back seat has rod end bearings that have slop in it (pivoting around the longitudinal axis) whereas the tube under the pilot seat doesn't have any slop between the tube and the ailerons since the rod end bearings going to the ailerons pivot about the lateral axis. I wasn't crazy about the autopilot servo having to twist the aft tube and move the bearing before it started turning the tube. Hope that makes sense.

Steve Sampson
05-07-2006, 04:38 AM
I looked hard at this, but came to the conclusion that it's not a good idea, because the aft tube under the back seat has rod end bearings that have slop in it (pivoting around the longitudinal axis) whereas the tube under the pilot seat doesn't have any slop between the tube and the ailerons since the rod end bearings going to the ailerons pivot about the lateral axis. I wasn't crazy about the autopilot servo having to twist the aft tube and move the bearing before it started turning the tube. Hope that makes sense.

Paul- can you clarify please? Either you are making a point which is going straight over my head, or we are talking at cross purposes, but I am not sure which. I was suggesting that the roll servo could be located further aft. It has to push sideways on the WD-407 both ends of which appear to be attached with the same bearings. Where along its length seems immaterial to me. Tom was suggesting it could be located into the forward bay where the stick is located - and it certainly could - but it just seems a little crowded for me. Stein was getting tangled with the footwells and I was speculating about moving a little further aft.

Have I missed something?

Thanks, Steve
#4478

pbesing
05-07-2006, 11:07 AM
I'm talking about the smaller tube that goes between the back seat stick and the belcrank in the baggage area. It is a smaller diameter tube. I wanted to put it in that bay underneath the back seat, and use this tube as in the TruTrak Drawings, just having to make a new clamp. The rod end bearings allow a twisting action. Grab the tube and twist left and right. You are not moving the ailerons, you are twisting the tube in the belcranks. Hope this makes sense. I'm going to use Tom's method previously mentioed. Looks like the best way for ease of installation and maintenance. I really wasn't crazy about the foot well idea. If you didn't have the footwell mod, it would be no big deal, since the servo would be under the floor. I just don't want lose room in the footwells, and have the servo kicked or something.