I am looking into a new digi cam and was wondering what kind of camera Doug uses. The quality of pictures that you take are just breathtaking. I am looking into something in the under $400 range. Currently, I am looking at the Kodak Easyshare 5 megapixel model Z740. Are there any cameras that compare to that one in that price range and has more features? Please let me know.....Trip to Texas is on Sat morning. Was looking to get it on Friday at Best Buy!
Van's Air Force
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Looking into a new digi cam...
- Thread starter RV-3Bravo
- Start date
Digital Rebel and Coolpix
Doug uses a 6MP Canon Digital Rebel, but you'd be hard pressed to find one for under $400, I believe. The new 8MP Rebel XT came out a few months ago and would be a great camera if you like SLR and can handle the higher pricetag.
If you're looking for a cheaper point-and-shoot, we've been happy with our Nikon Coolpix. You can get 7.1 MP for <$400.
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?A=details&kw=NICP7900&is=REG&Q=&O=productlist&sku=371018
It has fewer features than you one you mentioned and less zoom, but higher quality. However, unless you'll be printing large prints, it's probably moot and you'll probably be happier with the extra features and never notice the reduced quality. We prefer the CF over SD card, and needed the higher resolution. YMMV.
Doug uses a 6MP Canon Digital Rebel, but you'd be hard pressed to find one for under $400, I believe. The new 8MP Rebel XT came out a few months ago and would be a great camera if you like SLR and can handle the higher pricetag.
If you're looking for a cheaper point-and-shoot, we've been happy with our Nikon Coolpix. You can get 7.1 MP for <$400.
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?A=details&kw=NICP7900&is=REG&Q=&O=productlist&sku=371018
It has fewer features than you one you mentioned and less zoom, but higher quality. However, unless you'll be printing large prints, it's probably moot and you'll probably be happier with the extra features and never notice the reduced quality. We prefer the CF over SD card, and needed the higher resolution. YMMV.
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alpinelakespilot2000
Well Known Member
Check out these review sites which do not sell cameras and aren't affiliated with any major brands:
www.dpreview.com
www.stevesdigicams.com
If you're primarily interested in image quality, if they aren't "highly recommended" by these sites, don't buy those cameras.
As a former Nikon SLR amateur photographer, I now use a 4MP Canon G3 (non SLR) and think it takes as good of a picture as my old SLR. Lens quality is everything, SLR or otherwise, so again I'd encourage you to read some good indepth reviews.
Good luck.
www.dpreview.com
www.stevesdigicams.com
If you're primarily interested in image quality, if they aren't "highly recommended" by these sites, don't buy those cameras.
As a former Nikon SLR amateur photographer, I now use a 4MP Canon G3 (non SLR) and think it takes as good of a picture as my old SLR. Lens quality is everything, SLR or otherwise, so again I'd encourage you to read some good indepth reviews.
Good luck.
rv9aviator
Well Known Member
My very limited experience with digital cameras may not help but I have a Nikon 4500 Coolpix which is a good camera. I would probably buy a Canon next time. If you are over 25 years old you will probably have trouble with menu lay out on this model and the view screen is too small. there is way to much hunting for menu options. I do like the swivel lense for taking pictures of the building progress on my RV-9A.
I got my wife a Casio model for Christmas that she can carry in her purse. Shhhh... she doesn't know it yet. It is about the size of a credit card and only about 1/2 inch thick. I did try it out a little here at the office and it takes good photos.
Personally I use a Nikon D100 digital SLR and love it. As someone said the lense is the important part. I have about 3 times as much in lenses as I have in the camera.
On the smaller digital which are absolutely great now days, make sure and check shutter lag, how long it takes from when you push the button till the photo is captured. Many of the small digital take great pictures but are unusable for me due to the amount of lag and me being used to the SLR speed.
Good luck!
Personally I use a Nikon D100 digital SLR and love it. As someone said the lense is the important part. I have about 3 times as much in lenses as I have in the camera.
On the smaller digital which are absolutely great now days, make sure and check shutter lag, how long it takes from when you push the button till the photo is captured. Many of the small digital take great pictures but are unusable for me due to the amount of lag and me being used to the SLR speed.
Good luck!
Digital Camera
Myself and two other RV-ers at Hicks use Kodak digital in the 4 or 5 megapixel range. In flight photo quality is very good and the movie mode turns out some nice formation videos when you have the camera hard-mounted.
Sam's Club has the 5.0 Kodak for around $375.
Myself and two other RV-ers at Hicks use Kodak digital in the 4 or 5 megapixel range. In flight photo quality is very good and the movie mode turns out some nice formation videos when you have the camera hard-mounted.
Sam's Club has the 5.0 Kodak for around $375.
Doug's camera gear
Morning all,
I currently shoot with:
I get NO credit for any of this....on all the above items I emailed Sam Buchanan (RV-6 guy and wedding photographer) at various times over the past two years and asked, "What should I buy".
Having a 'full size' SLR type camera is a real plus for me. The cockpit is bumpy at times, and when you're trying to get a shot of morning fog in a turn, or a perfect sunrise/set, having a big camera body with easy to reach buttons that you don't have to look for is a huge advantage (IMHO).
If you're just starting out, the complete package (8MP, lens and memory card) for ~$850 would not be a bad choice.
I bought all my gear from www.BHPhotoVideo.com (pictures above from that site).
Like others have said...it's the lens and how fast you can take the next picture. It makes a difference...
Click click,
Morning all,
I currently shoot with:
- Off the shelf Canon 'Digital Rebel' (512MB card) Mine is 6MP but now they come with 8.
- 18-55mm EF-S Lens (came with the camera)
- 70-300mm image stabilized lens
- Canon 430EX Speedlite
- Flash frame similar to:
(for partys and such - makes red eye go away)
I get NO credit for any of this....on all the above items I emailed Sam Buchanan (RV-6 guy and wedding photographer) at various times over the past two years and asked, "What should I buy".
Having a 'full size' SLR type camera is a real plus for me. The cockpit is bumpy at times, and when you're trying to get a shot of morning fog in a turn, or a perfect sunrise/set, having a big camera body with easy to reach buttons that you don't have to look for is a huge advantage (IMHO).
If you're just starting out, the complete package (8MP, lens and memory card) for ~$850 would not be a bad choice.
I bought all my gear from www.BHPhotoVideo.com (pictures above from that site).
Like others have said...it's the lens and how fast you can take the next picture. It makes a difference...
Click click,
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akarmy
Well Known Member
So Doug,
Tell us a little bit about the "Image Stabilized" zoom you have.
I have a Nikon D70 with a non stabilized 80-200 and have not yet got a good picture from the air beyond about 120mm. Seems that there is always some shake when cruizing along.
Also, what shutterspeeds do you tend to use when doing air to air work?
Tell us a little bit about the "Image Stabilized" zoom you have.
I have a Nikon D70 with a non stabilized 80-200 and have not yet got a good picture from the air beyond about 120mm. Seems that there is always some shake when cruizing along.
Also, what shutterspeeds do you tend to use when doing air to air work?
I.S. rocks, Andy. It makes getting close and still very, very easy (example).akarmy said:
I usually shoot 250/th in air to air (TV mode) with the 300mm I.S. on because the subject doesn't have to get too close. Other times I just put the camera in program mode (P) and let it figure it out. Picasa can correct the lighting issues when I'm back at the house.
An example of my I love the zoom: this pic I was at 1,500' AGL
Here I was on a very extended base at Big Creek, ID with the zoom. I had about 2 seconds to take the shot before fully concentrating on the landing and, because the camera was a full size SLR and was sitting in the pax seat in sleep mode, all I had to do was feel for it, push the shutter button to wake it up and raise the camera for the shot. Never looked at the camera - an advantage in a situation like this.
Another zoom shot I like (300mm I.S.).
I would consider a I.S. 300mm lens required equipment now, but that's me....
Best,
Tom Maxwell
Well Known Member
Shutter Speeds
I am not Doug but I will jump in here. Image stabilization is nice. However it is not a pancea. It can only do so much. On average "IS" will give you 1 to 2 stops of additional shutter speed and still provide sharp pictures. You know that the faster the shutter speed the less subject movement and camera shake you get in your images. With "IS" what would take a shutter speed of 1/250 to make sharp could be had with a shutter speed of 1/125 or maybe even 1/60 of a second. The downside to "IS" is that you have to pay for it. We are talking $1500+ for these lenses. Yes I know most RV builders are swimming in cash but for some of us that is still a lot of money! Nikon's "IS" equivalent is found in their "VR" lenses. They are expensive as well. Canon's "IS" is a little better than Nikon's "VR" but if you shoot a Nikon that is a mute point.
A rule of thumb for shooting hand-held sharp images with a non "IS" telephoto is to use a minimum shutter speed of 1 over the length of the lens. For example if you are shooting at 200mm you should use 1/200 sec shutter speed or faster, 50mm 1/50 sec or faster, 300mm 1/300 or faster, etc. Again "IS" or "VR" will give you about 1 to 2 stops of additional leaway in your shutter speed and still maintain sharpness. Keep in mind that faster shutter speeds not only stop subject motion and camera shake but also propellers. if you want that blurred prop look in your images you will have to shoot at slower shutter speeds. "IS" definitely helps but shooting at slower shutter speeds still requires practice and a steady hand to get a sharp image. If you are on the ground and want to use a slower shutter speed, try panning the camera along the flight path of the airplane. With practice you will be able to get a sharp airplane with a blurred prop and a blurred background. This creates a nice image which implies a lot of speed and motion.
As you look at buying cameras, get what you need but don't overdo it. A camera bag with a DSLR, a couple of big lenses, a strobe, maybe a tripod, will use up a lot of that 100 lb baggage limit in a 2 seat RV. This may be fine if you are on a mission to get that one perfect image, but if you are headed out on an extended xcountry that weight might be better used elsewhere. On the other hand, that little pocket-sized camera takes up very little space and adds very little weight to the flight. It is easy to use and will save you a bundle as well.
The cameras are getting really really good and if you stick with the name brands you really can't go wrong. I am familiar with the Nikon and Canon cameras but that doesn't mean the other brands are not just as nice. I happen to like the software that Canon and Nikon provides for processing raw files. In a perfect world this is probably not a big deal but good software will pull detail out of a dark photo or save one that is 2 stops under exposed or about 1/2 stop overexposed.
My recommendation is that if you want maximum capability and flexibility and if you don't mind spending a few grand then the consumer line of Canon and Nikon DSLR cameras are the way to go. If you want to keep it under a grand and have ease of use and great images, go with one of the Canon or Nikon consumer grade cameras. Yes there are other brands out there that are fine, but it's a lot like buying an airplane kit. You can't go wrong with an RV and you can't go wrong with Canon or Nikon.
Have fun.
akarmy said:
I am not Doug but I will jump in here. Image stabilization is nice. However it is not a pancea. It can only do so much. On average "IS" will give you 1 to 2 stops of additional shutter speed and still provide sharp pictures. You know that the faster the shutter speed the less subject movement and camera shake you get in your images. With "IS" what would take a shutter speed of 1/250 to make sharp could be had with a shutter speed of 1/125 or maybe even 1/60 of a second. The downside to "IS" is that you have to pay for it. We are talking $1500+ for these lenses. Yes I know most RV builders are swimming in cash but for some of us that is still a lot of money!
Nikon's "IS" equivalent is found in their "VR" lenses. They are expensive as well. Canon's "IS" is a little better than Nikon's "VR" but if you shoot a Nikon that is a mute point.A rule of thumb for shooting hand-held sharp images with a non "IS" telephoto is to use a minimum shutter speed of 1 over the length of the lens. For example if you are shooting at 200mm you should use 1/200 sec shutter speed or faster, 50mm 1/50 sec or faster, 300mm 1/300 or faster, etc. Again "IS" or "VR" will give you about 1 to 2 stops of additional leaway in your shutter speed and still maintain sharpness. Keep in mind that faster shutter speeds not only stop subject motion and camera shake but also propellers. if you want that blurred prop look in your images you will have to shoot at slower shutter speeds. "IS" definitely helps but shooting at slower shutter speeds still requires practice and a steady hand to get a sharp image. If you are on the ground and want to use a slower shutter speed, try panning the camera along the flight path of the airplane. With practice you will be able to get a sharp airplane with a blurred prop and a blurred background. This creates a nice image which implies a lot of speed and motion.
As you look at buying cameras, get what you need but don't overdo it. A camera bag with a DSLR, a couple of big lenses, a strobe, maybe a tripod, will use up a lot of that 100 lb baggage limit in a 2 seat RV. This may be fine if you are on a mission to get that one perfect image, but if you are headed out on an extended xcountry that weight might be better used elsewhere. On the other hand, that little pocket-sized camera takes up very little space and adds very little weight to the flight. It is easy to use and will save you a bundle as well.
The cameras are getting really really good and if you stick with the name brands you really can't go wrong. I am familiar with the Nikon and Canon cameras but that doesn't mean the other brands are not just as nice. I happen to like the software that Canon and Nikon provides for processing raw files. In a perfect world this is probably not a big deal but good software will pull detail out of a dark photo or save one that is 2 stops under exposed or about 1/2 stop overexposed.
My recommendation is that if you want maximum capability and flexibility and if you don't mind spending a few grand then the consumer line of Canon and Nikon DSLR cameras are the way to go. If you want to keep it under a grand and have ease of use and great images, go with one of the Canon or Nikon consumer grade cameras. Yes there are other brands out there that are fine, but it's a lot like buying an airplane kit. You can't go wrong with an RV and you can't go wrong with Canon or Nikon.
Have fun.
Mike S
Senior Curmudgeon
What do you plan to do with it???
One thing I noeiced on this thread is that the resolution for web publishing hasnt been addressed. while a 6 or 8 mp camera is nice for print media use, when you put something on the web, files from these cameras become a bit big.
Doug, what size do you use for web publishing?? and e-mailing big files is really a pain, specially if you have dial-up.
Start by defining your mission, just like if you were buying a plane, and work on from there.
Mike
P.S., Wannabe, if you are interested in looking at, and talking RV's, we have a bunch of them in the area, both flying and under const. Send me a message.
One thing I noeiced on this thread is that the resolution for web publishing hasnt been addressed. while a 6 or 8 mp camera is nice for print media use, when you put something on the web, files from these cameras become a bit big.
Doug, what size do you use for web publishing?? and e-mailing big files is really a pain, specially if you have dial-up.
Start by defining your mission, just like if you were buying a plane, and work on from there.
Mike
P.S., Wannabe, if you are interested in looking at, and talking RV's, we have a bunch of them in the area, both flying and under const. Send me a message.
RV7Factory
Chief Obfuscation Officer
rvw...rvwannabe said:
I had a Z740 until recently when I upgraded to a Kodak P850. If you take a look at my web site, all of the log pictures taken before say October were taken with the Z740. While I like the P850, sometimes I wish I had just stuck with the Z740 as many times I think the image quality from the Z740 was superior. I haven't used any other cameras so I won't comment on others, but I was real happy with the Z740. Simple, not many features, but a 10x zoom and great pics for the price.
On another note... I have bought my last two cameras from Costco. Why... their prices are awesome, and their return policy cannot be beat. You will often find a camera package (camera, memory, case, etc.) at Costco less than you will find the camera alone at Best Buy or other stores. Often your savings will even pay for your Costco membership if you don't already have one. Just my $.02.
PS - If you do go Kodak, don't bother with the EasyShare software, it stinks. Just use Picasa (like Doug said). YMMV.
Good luck.
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N916K
Well Known Member
Canon A series
I have a few of the Canon A series cameras. I believe the A620 is their highest level right now. It's 7.1 megapixal and runs about $350 at B&H. The things I like about the Canon A series point and shoot cameras is that they use AA batteries, a common data starage card, and Canon sells very cheap and good underwater cases for them. I scuba dive and the cameras work great for diving trips. If you run out of memory it's easy to have someone burn a CD from the memory cards or even get a new memory card. And with using AA bateries you can always buy new batteries, not something you can do with a special battery pack.
I took an underwater digital photography class this year. It's amazing what these point and shoot cameras can do with just a little bit of education. As long as you don't need the powerful zoom features a point and shoot should do you quite well.
rvwannabe said:
I have a few of the Canon A series cameras. I believe the A620 is their highest level right now. It's 7.1 megapixal and runs about $350 at B&H. The things I like about the Canon A series point and shoot cameras is that they use AA batteries, a common data starage card, and Canon sells very cheap and good underwater cases for them. I scuba dive and the cameras work great for diving trips. If you run out of memory it's easy to have someone burn a CD from the memory cards or even get a new memory card. And with using AA bateries you can always buy new batteries, not something you can do with a special battery pack.
I took an underwater digital photography class this year. It's amazing what these point and shoot cameras can do with just a little bit of education. As long as you don't need the powerful zoom features a point and shoot should do you quite well.
akarmy
Well Known Member
Tom Maxwell said:
Thanks for the detailed writeup Tom. Good stuff.
I know and agree with everything you said. Here's a sample of what I'm talking about.
Photo Properties
Model NIKON D70
Aperture Value f/6.3
Focal Length 165.00 mm
ISO 200
Shutter Speed Value 1/639 sec
This is the best of a series I took that all were slightly blurry. I'm was just wondering if a VR lense would help make it that much easier! I've kind of determined for my setup now I need to have at least 400+ shutterspeed to shoot from the plane with the zoom.
On another note, the only problem with all these cool zooms and digital SLR's in an RV is that I tend to hit the window with the long lenses. It seemed much easier with the small point and shoots... I do agree with Doug that the instant on and instant shutter are priceless.
Sam Buchanan
been here awhile
a little unsharp mask goes a long way
Nice photo! A lot of good info has been presented in this thread. Don't forget that a significant part of mastering digital photography is getting very familiar with imaging software. I took Andy's image and threw a little "unsharp mask" from Photoshop at it just for comparison (original image on top). This is not a very good illustration of what can be done post-production since I was working from a small jpeg and the inherent jpg artifacts but this might pique the interest of those who haven't poked around in imaging software.
A VR lens is a nice piece of equipment but don't overlook extracting as much quality as possible from the file via software. Also, the closer two aircraft are to each other, the shorter focal length lens that can be used (which will minimize camera/subject motion issues) and that will have a significant impact on image quality.
Obviously, skilled formation pilots are the rule of the day!
Sam Buchanan
http://sambuchanan.com
Nice photo! A lot of good info has been presented in this thread. Don't forget that a significant part of mastering digital photography is getting very familiar with imaging software. I took Andy's image and threw a little "unsharp mask" from Photoshop at it just for comparison (original image on top). This is not a very good illustration of what can be done post-production since I was working from a small jpeg and the inherent jpg artifacts but this might pique the interest of those who haven't poked around in imaging software.
A VR lens is a nice piece of equipment but don't overlook extracting as much quality as possible from the file via software. Also, the closer two aircraft are to each other, the shorter focal length lens that can be used (which will minimize camera/subject motion issues) and that will have a significant impact on image quality.
Obviously, skilled formation pilots are the rule of the day!
Sam Buchanan
http://sambuchanan.com
john kelley
Member
I have been a Nikon 35 mm SLR user for quite a while so when looking for digital I stuck with Nikon to reuse my lenses. I just bought a Nikon D50 body on line at ephotocraft. It was the lowest "non scam" price I could find and it worked out. One thing not mentioned is the speed of the flash card you put in your camera. I am not sure on the Canon's but on the Nikon's to get the rated 2.5 frames per second you should upgrage the speed of the memory card a little. I got a sandisk Ultra II 1Gb card for $50 after rebate from buy.com. I love the camera so far. With ~284 pictures at high resolution on the card shoot like a madman then pick out and touch up the good ones on the PC.
They aren't RV's but I stuck a couple of samples up you can check out if you like for why a short lag time is important (at least to me)
http://r2-racing.com/samples/swim.jpg - photo was taken while the bikes were traveling probably around 25 mph or so but only available for a skpit second. This one was the cover shot on Cycle USA for that month.
and when not to use IS or VR lenses
http://r2-racing.com/samples/511.jpg - this one was taken with the rider traveling through fairly heavy brush at probably close to 40 mph and about 10 feet away, panning the camera bout as fast as I could swing it
The IS or VR lenses do not seem to like panning as in the last photo. They are absolutely great for shooting fro ma vehicle though. One of these days I am supposed to get the opportunity to shoot some RV's in flight and then I will have some airplane photos. I'm looking forward to it.
http://r2-racing.com/samples/swim.jpg - photo was taken while the bikes were traveling probably around 25 mph or so but only available for a skpit second. This one was the cover shot on Cycle USA for that month.
and when not to use IS or VR lenses
http://r2-racing.com/samples/511.jpg - this one was taken with the rider traveling through fairly heavy brush at probably close to 40 mph and about 10 feet away, panning the camera bout as fast as I could swing it
The IS or VR lenses do not seem to like panning as in the last photo. They are absolutely great for shooting fro ma vehicle though. One of these days I am supposed to get the opportunity to shoot some RV's in flight and then I will have some airplane photos.
I'm looking forward to it.
akarmy
Well Known Member
Radomir said:
2 things... 1 I already threw away the best samples of unfocused images due to shake, that was the "worst" I could find in the archives...
2. Ya, closer... I can do the 10 foot thing, just not with the camera in my hands!
Here's the reverse view during the same flight!
Radomir
Well Known Member
I've only tried it a few times, but definitely the closer they were the better pics I got.. even with a [lot] crappier lens.
some close-up examples:
http://vansrv.myphotoalbum.com/view_album.php?set_albumName=album02&page=1
(granted, I was a pax)
while you could try faster shutter speed, I'm not convinced it'd help much... looks like you were already at 1/750s
some close-up examples:
http://vansrv.myphotoalbum.com/view_album.php?set_albumName=album02&page=1
(granted, I was a pax)
while you could try faster shutter speed, I'm not convinced it'd help much... looks like you were already at 1/750s
