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Van's is going with a glass panel on the RV-12 prototype

Maybe they'll start making the other models more glass compatible (i.e. moving the panel rib on the 7/9 tip-up).

They'll have a lot of wires running around with every engine sensor hooked up to two different systems.
 
Glass Panel RV-12

I know it says they want to do a heads up comparison with the two different models but I think they will be loosing a bunch of the greatness from Dynon by going with two different systems. The power in the Dynon system is the ability to share data and swap screens between the units. Very powerfull.
If that was my puppy and I had Van's money, I would put in a D100 on the left and a D180 on the right. This gives the best glass panel features and redundancy for the buck out there. Couple this setup with the new HSI driven by a switchable source of either the SL-30 or the GPS and you got a great system.
 
Probably more of a marketing decision than a technical one. Van's sells both units and I expect they didn't want to upset either vendor by using only the other's unit.
 
I think that the single-screen combo EFIS/engine monitor type instruments (Dynon D-180, ACS AF-3400/3500 Combo) are a great way to go for LSA - simple installation, all the instrumentaion you need for a LSA, easy to understand. Remember that the completion time for the RV-12 is supposed to be closer to 500 hours than 1500, so making the panel simple to build is a real plus.

That said, the 912S doesn't require that much in the way of instrumentation - OT, OP, 1x CHT, 2x EGT and tach are the minimum. Amps, fuel flow and fuel pressure are optional.

Doug
 
What kind of fuses are they using that light up when they blow? Kind of a neat idea having them plug directly into the instrument panel. I hadn't thought about that before.
 
Front accessible fuse holder

I want to know who manufactures a "front-accessible" fuse holder....
 
Glass Cockpit

Glass! Vans! If it were not September I would have thought it April Fools.
 
That said, the 912S doesn't require that much in the way of instrumentation - OT, OP, 1x CHT, 2x EGT and tach are the minimum. Amps, fuel flow and fuel pressure are optional.


Per FAR 91.205, CHT, oil temp, and EGT are optional for the 912. But you are required to have a water temp gauge.

But wait! 91.205 is for standard airworthiness certificates or experimental aircraft that will be flown at night or IFR. If the RV-12 is operated as LSA, it doesn't have to have any instruments!

Or do the op lims for LSA call out instrument requirements? I haven't seen a copy of the LSA operating limitations yet.
 
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Sam Buchanan said:
Per FAR 91.205, CHT, oil temp, and EGT are optional for the 912. But you are required to have a water temp gauge.
And this is very interesting with the 912 series! Water temp is rarely monitored. However, the CHT is taken in the cooling jacket, so you're really getting water temp. But, technically, the sensor is measuring the temperature of the metal, not the water.
 
Brantel said:
I know it says they want to do a heads up comparison with the two different models but I think they will be loosing a bunch of the greatness from Dynon by going with two different systems. The power in the Dynon system is the ability to share data and swap screens between the units. Very powerfull.
If that was my puppy and I had Van's money, I would put in a D100 on the left and a D180 on the right. This gives the best glass panel features and redundancy for the buck out there. Couple this setup with the new HSI driven by a switchable source of either the SL-30 or the GPS and you got a great system.


Sounds like you've been to someone's booth at an airshow recently :) Ok, it's kind of a joke and you're right - to an extent, but you could literally swap out the "Dxxx" in your quote and insert "AFxxx" and your statement would read the same. One uses 2x"DSAB" wires to swap data, the other an ethernet cable. Both have a new "brighter screen", both have combo boxes, and both have backup batteries. Both companies have a lot of new "enhancements/goodies" coming down the pike.

I too sell and install a lot of both (along with producing the OEM harnesses for both companies) so I'm pretty well aware of both systems. Both are excellent systems, and as someone stated previously people in a position like Van's (and to an extent myself) are kind of publically obligated not to favor one company over another - especially when both of them make such nice products.

We're building a -7 now, and we might have to end up having a similar panel for a couple reasons. First, I don't want to make anyone mad, and 2nd it will be a great way for me to demo multiple systems. I'm thinking 1 big Dynon, 1 Big AFS, 1 Blue Mountain, 1 Chelton and 1 GRT outta do it! I'm half serious about that, it would be a pretty neat way to demo all of the screens in a flight condition without openly favoring one over the other, don't you think?

I asked Van's at OSH if I could have the 1st RV-12 kit, and Tom told me I would already have to be down the list a ways, and on top of that I'll have to wait some undeterminate amount of time to get one :( You ask....why would someone like me want an LSA - well, I now have a decent amount of employees (14) and I would like to have a "club airplane" for everyone to fly. Cheap & fun to fly, cheap to insure, and most every one of us has the skills to fly it (although you wouldn't know it if you saw some of my landings last week)! Plus, we can take the wings off it and jam into the corner of the hangar if we needed to!

Cheers,
Stein.
 
Sorry, this is off topic

That sounds like a darn fine company you're running there Stein. I wish my boss would look into buying us an airplane to fly around in. :D
 
the_other_dougreeves said:
And this is very interesting with the 912 series! Water temp is rarely monitored. However, the CHT is taken in the cooling jacket, so you're really getting water temp. But, technically, the sensor is measuring the temperature of the metal, not the water.

I have been operating a 912S engine for over 500 hours and that is not my experience. I use the GRT EIS system and it tells me everything I need to know about my engine and it comes with an idiot light to tell me when my water temp is reaching 208 degrees or my oil temp is reaching 228 degrees. At that time I lower the air deflector to the radiators to increase air flow and bring the temps down and the light goes out. I like to fly with oil at 220 and water at 170 regardles of the OAT. Monitoring oil, water and CHT temps in the 912 is key to its longevity and a must prior to takeoff (I always like to see 120 degrees on all three parameters).

My EIS has 2 EGT, 2 CHT, RPM, Water Temp, Oil Temp, Oil Pressure, Voltage, Fuel Level, Hobbs meter, Flight Time meter, and Manifold pressure (The Maniflod pressure helps those that fly with the IVO inflight adjustable magnum prop). That setup today is worth roughly $950 bucks and comes with a custom harness to length for each sensor.

The EIS is fairly inexpensive, when compared to the steam gauge alternative and takes little space, it is made in the USA, and works all the time. It is widely used in the light aircraft community and has a long track record of trouble free performance. In other words, install it and forget about it ever failing.

The point of LSA is to build KISS airplanes and loading them with complex electronics goes counter to that. Granted this is a POC plane designed to blind and attract suspects, but loading them with electroincs that have little use in a fair weather, day VFR airplane is goofy and sends the wrong message to the would be pilots/owners. The idea of LSA is to have an easy to maintain airplane with simple systems that need practiclly no maintenance and a bulletproof engine that requires only oil, filter, and plug changes all the way to TBO!

BTW, the CHT monitors the temperature of the (water cooled) HEAD, the water temp is monitored at the output port of the water collector manifold. The option to monitor the CWT (Cylinder wall temp) exists but I never seen a single 912 with it.

PepeBorja
 
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